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RE: If I were an Atheist
May 2, 2015 at 4:50 am
(This post was last modified: May 2, 2015 at 4:52 am by AdamLOV.)
(May 2, 2015 at 4:36 am)abaris Wrote: May I just note that I don't give one single shit about humanity going extinct at some point. I'm living here and now and there are quite a few more important issues to worry about. For me the argument is on the same lines as the sun blowing up in about 3 to 4 billion years. Well, I won't be there to suffer the consequences.
Extinction is independent from discourse. It does not care about human discourse either. It is the elephant in the room, so to speak, by far the most important issue. One can ignore it, but the ontological fact of ungroundedness remains true.
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RE: If I were an Atheist
May 2, 2015 at 5:01 am
It's possible to talk about more than one subject.
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RE: If I were an Atheist
May 2, 2015 at 5:09 am
(May 2, 2015 at 4:50 am)AdamLOV Wrote: (May 2, 2015 at 4:36 am)abaris Wrote: May I just note that I don't give one single shit about humanity going extinct at some point. I'm living here and now and there are quite a few more important issues to worry about. For me the argument is on the same lines as the sun blowing up in about 3 to 4 billion years. Well, I won't be there to suffer the consequences.
Extinction is independent from discourse. It does not care about human discourse either. It is the elephant in the room, so to speak, by far the most important issue. One can ignore it, but the ontological fact of ungroundedness remains true.
So... what?
He who loves God cannot endeavour that God should love him in return - Baruch Spinoza
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RE: If I were an Atheist
May 2, 2015 at 5:13 am
(This post was last modified: May 2, 2015 at 5:14 am by robvalue.)
The only take-home I can get from this is that we should be talking only about preventing extinction. All other discourse is wasted. I don't agree with this extreme stance, but at least it is a stance.
Otherwise, all that is being suggested is that we sit around moaning about it, and how pointless things are.
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RE: If I were an Atheist
May 2, 2015 at 5:13 am
(This post was last modified: May 2, 2015 at 5:14 am by AdamLOV.)
(May 2, 2015 at 3:34 am)downbeatplumb Wrote: Eventually the world will end, so why get out of bed?
Ontological antinomianism brackets activity (all activity). This by no means implies that one should not persist in the semblance of activity, merely that one recognize the contingency and, by consequence, senselessness of activity. It is to act without belief in one's own actions.
(May 2, 2015 at 3:34 am)downbeatplumb Wrote: Eventually the world will end, so why get out of bed?
Ontological antinomianism brackets activity (all activity). This by no means implies that one should not persist in the semblance of activity, merely that one recognize the contingency and, by consequence, senselessness of activity. It is to act without belief in one's own actions.
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RE: If I were an Atheist
May 2, 2015 at 5:16 am
(This post was last modified: May 2, 2015 at 5:18 am by robvalue.)
I'm sure most people here (atheists at least) would admit there is no such thing as objective meaning, that we'll eventually go extinct, and that hard solipsism can't be beaten. We don't pretend otherwise.
Does that satisfy your criteria? What is to be gained my mentioning it constantly and not trying to enjoy whatever appears to be real and to help those who also appear to be real? And addressing problems that appear to be real? What is the alternative?
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RE: If I were an Atheist
May 2, 2015 at 5:23 am
(May 2, 2015 at 5:16 am)robvalue Wrote: I'm sure most people here (atheists at least) would admit there is no such thing as objective meaning, that we'll eventually go extinct, and that hard solipsism can't be beaten. We don't pretend otherwise.
Does that satisfy your criteria? What is to be gained my mentioning it constantly and not trying to enjoy whatever appears to be real and to help those who also appear to be real? And addressing problems that appear to be real? What is the alternative?
In the above I seem to have accidentally sent the reply twice, apologies for the mistake. Now as to the matter at hand, the alternative to action would be contemplation. One who contemplates places less stress on the environment that one who acts (reproduces, works, etc).
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RE: If I were an Atheist
May 2, 2015 at 5:25 am
(May 2, 2015 at 5:13 am)AdamLOV Wrote: (May 2, 2015 at 3:34 am)downbeatplumb Wrote: Eventually the world will end, so why get out of bed?
Ontological antinomianism brackets activity (all activity). This by no means implies that one should not persist in the semblance of activity, merely that one recognize the contingency and, by consequence, senselessness of activity. It is to act without belief in one's own actions.
(May 2, 2015 at 3:34 am)downbeatplumb Wrote: Eventually the world will end, so why get out of bed?
Ontological antinomianism brackets activity (all activity). This by no means implies that one should not persist in the semblance of activity, merely that one recognize the contingency and, by consequence, senselessness of activity. It is to act without belief in one's own actions.
And in the end kinetic energy of the universe will abate and everything will end to be just endless cold, the heat death of the universe.
So what?
You can fix ignorance, you can't fix stupid.
Tinkety Tonk and down with the Nazis.
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RE: If I were an Atheist
May 2, 2015 at 5:45 am
(May 2, 2015 at 5:13 am)AdamLOV Wrote: (May 2, 2015 at 3:34 am)downbeatplumb Wrote: Eventually the world will end, so why get out of bed?
Ontological antinomianism brackets activity (all activity). This by no means implies that one should not persist in the semblance of activity, merely that one recognize the contingency and, by consequence, senselessness of activity. It is to act without belief in one's own actions. It reminds me of the myth of Sisyphus. But I could think of nothing more senseless than refusing to push the rock if in fact doing so is a source of pleasure.
He who loves God cannot endeavour that God should love him in return - Baruch Spinoza
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RE: If I were an Atheist
May 2, 2015 at 5:48 am
(May 2, 2015 at 5:45 am)Nestor Wrote: (May 2, 2015 at 5:13 am)AdamLOV Wrote: Ontological antinomianism brackets activity (all activity). This by no means implies that one should not persist in the semblance of activity, merely that one recognize the contingency and, by consequence, senselessness of activity. It is to act without belief in one's own actions. It reminds me of the myth of Sisyphus. But I could think of nothing more senseless than refusing to push the rock if in fact doing so is a source of pleasure. It gave him a goal and if he worked on his technique well maybe tomorrow will be the day.
You can fix ignorance, you can't fix stupid.
Tinkety Tonk and down with the Nazis.
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