Existence of Israel is fulfillment of Biblical prophesies

[Minimalist]

I said god had some glue. its pretty clear to me.

Yeah but someone should have noticed and wrote something down. Frankly, someone would have shit a brick if the moon "split apart."

[Jaysyn]

again with the claims with no evidence quote me the verse that contains a prophecy about israel

Verses out of an old book aren't evidence.

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And which would be obliterated by the numerous enemies surrounding it if other nations were to stop propping it up.

Uh, no. Can you say 6 Day War & Air Force second only to the USA in training & equipment. Israel is bloodthirsty & their next serious aggressor will more than likely be nuked out of existence.

True, and judging by their relationship to the US, I'm fairly certain they like their rather mercenary assistance.

We give them money, they screw over their neighbors - seems fair to me, right?

I didn't say it was right or good, just the way things are right now.

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

If you study the Bible

I can't think of a bigger waste of fucking time.

No learning is a waste of time,it's all personal and relative.

However,the statement about studying the Bible is also a rather arrogant and stupid ad hominem. IE "you don't agree with me because you're ignorant" In fact, a lot of us here are former theists who have read and studied the Bible.


Some of us get a bit miffed when some willfully ignorant fool comes along with his exclusivist drivel and proceeds to to tell us how wrong we are,unlike his wise and holy self.

I have never once seen any evidence which proves the existence of pecognition ( predicting the future) That includes all religious prophecy, including fatuous Christian claims that the mythicak Jesus of the Gospels fulffilled prophecy of the Torah. [ for the Messiah]. He didn't.

Claims made by Adventists, JW's and other failed millenarian sects are invariably made after the event or via some inventive interpretation of the surreal Book of Revelations.

To be fair, I've never actually come across a specific prophecy; EG at 2.30pm Wed 23 June 2012, Jesus wil come again,appearing at the hippodrome in Dallas Texas. OR: On Monday 2 August 2010 at 11am, Iran will destroy Israel with a nuclear bomb. (or vice versa) Christian prophecy of the evangelical variety usually needs to be interpreted by some semi-literate redneck who barely reads English, let alone ancient Greek or Hebrew.

[Minimalist]

No learning is a waste of time,it's all personal and relative.

Xtians aren't talking about "learning", Pad. They are talking about accepting it without question.


Major difference.

[Scented Nectar]

Israel is stolen land. Stolen from one theocracy to make a different theocracy. After WW2, why weren't the jews simply reinstated into the countries they already lived in, like Germany and Poland etc, with full equal citizen rights and their property returned. That would have been kind of reasonable. Going to some other country though, stealing their land, and giving it to some people who weren't even born there, is so fucking stupid, that of course it took religion to make the people accept it as something good. Fucking morons. Time to dump all the theocracy there, and replace it with modern secular laws that treat everyone fairly no matter what their nonbeliefs/beliefs are.

[annatar]

again with the claims with no evidence quote me the verse that contains a prophecy about israel

Verses out of an old book aren't evidence.

in this case it was evidence and i gave it to him.

[Rev. Rye]

Israel is stolen land. Stolen from one theocracy to make a different theocracy. After WW2, why weren't the jews simply reinstated into the countries they already lived in, like Germany and Poland etc, with full equal citizen rights and their property returned. That would have been kind of reasonable.

Of course, would there be any guarantee that there wouldn't be a return to Nazi-style anti-semitism? I mean, even though the American occupiers managed to instill Germany with such a guilt for their actions that such a thing was unlikely, do you really think that the Jews could still trust their "Good German" neighbors?

On the other hand, giving somebody a scrap of land just because their ancestors ruled it briefly millenia ago is an asinine idea. I mean, I am descended from no less than two lines from the Emperor Charlemagne. Does this make me entitled to take over most of France, Western Germany, Austria, Northern Italy, a small part of the former Yugoslavia, and even a bit of Basque Country?

[annatar]

On the other hand, giving somebody a scrap of land just because their ancestors ruled it briefly millenia ago is an asinine idea. I mean, I am descended from no less than two lines from the Emperor Charlemagne. Does this make me entitled to take over most of France, Western Germany, Austria, Northern Italy, a small part of the former Yugoslavia, and even a bit of Basque Country?

Its just a political game.. America wanted an ally in that area and Jews were the best suited for this job.

[DeistPaladin]

If you study the Bible

I can't think of a bigger waste of fucking time.

Don't knock it. It's the most effective way to get Christians to deconvert. Nearly every ex-Christian I know got started in the journey to reason that way.

[DeistPaladin]

If you want evidence that the Bible is true all you have to do is look at a map of the Middle East. There you will see a country called Israel, which has come back into existence after an absence of more than 1800 years.

If you study the Bible you will find that God warned the Jews that if they sinned they would be scattered among the nations. This happened after they rejected Jesus as being the Messiah God had promised. But even while they were wanderers without a home of their own God still protected them from being destroyed or assimilated into the nations where they lived and enabled them to preserve their language and culture. He did this because he had also promised to regather them to their own land at the end of the age. This began to happen when the nation of Israel was established.

You can find out more of what the Bible says about their present return here:

http://www.arielm.org/dcs/pdf/mbs189m.pdf

If you want to learn more details about the history of the Jews I recommend that you read God, Jews, and History by Max I. Dimont

Three words:

1. Self
2. Fulfilling
3. Prophecy

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