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January 8, 2016 at 11:20 am (This post was last modified: January 8, 2016 at 11:22 am by Sheed1980.)
(January 8, 2016 at 11:17 am)drfuzzy Wrote:
(January 8, 2016 at 12:45 am)Sheed1980 Wrote: What u have to consider is that Allah(God) created us out of nothing.
What I mean by this is that with the big bang theory Someone had to start the big bang. So Allah decided how everything of our universe: galaxies, planets, stars, atmospheres were going to be formed from the big bang explosion. Then He simply said the word "Be" and everything came into being. I'm not saying all at once but into the process of particles becoming planets and stars etc. Then at a point in time after our Earth had been in existence for so long, as said in the Holy Qur'an, He sent His angels, messengers He created from light, to gather handfuls of earth. Black dirt, white dirt, red dirt, brown dirt and yellow dirt.(which is why we as humans come in all different colors) Then the angels mixed the dirt with water, the element that gives life, and made it a sticky clay. Then the clay was moulded into a statue which God brought to life as Adam(PBUH). So as u see since the Earth was created from absolutely nothing(big bang), and Adam(PBUH)was created from the earth, this verifies that we as mankind, like everything else Allah created, came from nothing. He created us all from nothing. So if Allah has the power to create us from ABSOLUTELY NOTHING, then after we die after having been SOMETHING, why couldn't He bring us back to life? Not to belittle Allah Almighty's power but It seems less of a miracle to bring something back to life that once existed, than to create life into existence from nothing at all. Also ur brain is not what gives life. Yes it is a very, very important factor to our living, but not the cause of life. Brain-dead people considered vegetables
still are alive until their souls are removed from their bodies. This world we live in now is temporary. We were all created for the afterlife. Eternally to reside in Paradise or Hell-fire, where life will be many, many times better or worse than we could possibly imagine. So as we are taught in the Qur'an, when u feel ur soul exiting ur body, it will be one of two ways. For a good believer(Muslim)angels with faces white as the sun come down to him from heaven with one of the shrouds of paradise and some of the perfume of paradise and sit away from him as far as the eye can see. Then the angel of death comes and sits at his head and says, ‘Good soul, come out to forgiveness and acceptance from Allah.’ It then comes out as a drop flows from a water-skin and he seizes it; and when he does so they do not leave it in his hand for an instant, but take it and place it in that shroud and that perfume, and from it there comes forth a fragrance like that of the sweetest musk found on the face of the earth. They then take it up and do not bring it past a company of angels without their asking, "Who is this good soul?’ to which they reply, ‘So and so, the son of so and so’, using the best names by which people called him on the earth. They then bring him to the lowest heaven and ask that the gate should be opened for him. This is done, and from every heaven its archangels escort him to the next heaven until it is brought to the seventh heaven, and Allah who is great and glorious says, ‘Record the book of my servant in Illiyyun and take him back to earth, for I created mankind from it, I shall return them into it, and from it I shall bring them forth another time.’ His soul is then restored to his body, two angels come to him, and making him sit up say to him, ‘ Who is our Lord’ He replies, ‘My Lord is Allah.’ They ask, ‘What is your religion?’ and he replies, ‘My religion is Islam.’ They ask, ‘Who is this man who was sent among you?’ and he replies, ‘He is Allah’s Messenger.’ They ask, ‘What is your [source of] knowledge?’ and he replies, ‘I have read Allah’s Book, believed in it and declared it to be true.’ Then one cries from heaven, ‘My servant has spoken the truth, so spread out carpets for him from paradise, and open a gate for him into paradise.’ Then some of its joy and its fragrance comes to him, his grave is made spacious for him as far as the eye can see, and a man with a beautiful face, beautiful garments and a sweet odor comes to him and says, ‘Rejoice in what pleases you for this is your day which you have been promised.’ He asks, ‘Who are you, for your face is perfectly beautiful and brings good?" He replies, ‘I am your good deeds.’ He then says, ‘My Lord, bring the last hour; my Lord, bring the last hour, so that I may return to my people and my property. For the disbeliever/wicked soul angels with black faces come down to him from heaven with hair-cloth and sit away from him as far as the eye can see. Then the angel of death comes and sits at his head and says, ‘Wicked soul, come out to displeasure from Allah.’ Then it becomes dissipated in his body, and he draws it out as a branch of thorns is pulled out from wet wool. He then seizes it, and when he does so they do not leave it in his hand for an instant, but put it in that hair-cloth and from it comes forth a stench like the most offensive corpse found on the face of the earth. They then take it up and do not bring it past a company of angels without their saying, ‘Who is this wicked soul?’ to which they reply, ‘So and so, the son of so and so’, using the worst names that he was called in the world. When he is brought to the lowest heaven request is made that the gate be opened for him, but it is not opened for him. (Allah’s Messenger (saws) then recited, ‘The gates of heaven will not be opened for them and they will not enter paradise until a camel can pass through the eye of a needle.’ Allah who is most Great and Glorious then says, ‘Record his book in Sijjin in the lowest earth,’ and his soul is thrown down. (He (saws) then recited, ‘He who assigns partners to Allah is as if he had fallen down from heaven and been snatched up by the birds, or made to fall by the wind in a place far distant.’ His soul is then restored to his body, two angels come to him, and making him sit up say to him, ‘Who is your Lord?’ He replies, ‘Alas, alas, I do not know.’ They ask, ‘What is your religion?’ He replies, ‘Alas, alas, I do not know.’ They ask ‘Who is this man who was sent among you?’ He replies, Alas, alas, I do not know.’ Then one cries out from heaven, ‘He has lied, so spread out carpets from hell for him, and open a gate for him into hell.’ Then some of its heat and hot air comes to him, his grave is made narrow for him so that his ribs are pressed together in it and a man with an ugly face, ugly garments and an offensive odor come to him and says, Be grieved with what displeases you, for this is your day which you have been promised.’ He asks ‘Who are you, for your face is most ugly and brings evil?’ He replies, ‘l am your wicked deeds.’ He then says, My Lord, do not bring the last hour.[/font][/size] [/i]
tl;dr
Allah doesn't exist. Yahweh doesn't exist. Neither does Jesus, Zeus, Mithra, Ahura-Mazda, Odin, Apollo, Osiris, Ra, Shiva, Rama, the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus, or the Easter Bunny.
Then who created us where did we come from? I agree with u about all those other names except Allah and Jesus(PBUH). Allah is God Almighty and Jesus(PBUH)was one of His greatest messengers and prophets to mankind
(January 7, 2016 at 3:34 pm)ApeNotKillApe Wrote: The "program" needs a piece of machinery to receive and interpret the digital information, does it not?
(January 7, 2016 at 3:27 pm)Drich Wrote: Here is a simple way to look at it: The Brain is just a receiver/OS that drives the hardware/Your bodily function. The soul is the you 'program' located in 'the cloud.'
It's like a cloud based App/Game. Your brain/body is like your phone. It is the interface to the app/cloud based Game that can be done anywhere.
Has there ever been, in the history of the world, any event that would imply that might be the case? Instant communication between our brains and our souls over vast distances without interruption? Signals that are undetectable though right?
That claim seriously needs some supporting evidence!
That's 3 dimensional thinking.
If you read the bible from a technical POV God can be defined as an inter-dimensional being. Then it means (the part made in his image) we are as well. If we/soul are inter dimensional beings then we can exist on two different plains of existence occupying the same time and space.
I saw something on this in a documentary some where, can remember when or where.. But their is solid math that supports this theory.
A theory no different than any other based on math with no supporting physical evidence *cough higgs/boson
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
(January 7, 2016 at 3:27 pm)Drich Wrote: Here is a simple way to look at it: The Brain is just a receiver/OS that drives the hardware/Your bodily function. The soul is the you 'program' located in 'the cloud.'
It's like a cloud based App/Game. Your brain/body is like your phone. It is the interface to the app/cloud based Game that can be done anywhere.
So do squirrels have souls? How about finches? Or trout? Does the Ghost in the Machine metaphor extend to every other creature with a brain and complex nervous system? If not, why not?
Soul is defined as a living consciousness that was given as a gift from God to man. This gift is unique to man.
As paul identifies in our roman's study we are a dual natured being. The Soul is but one aspect of our existence. This body does indeed literally have a mind of it's own as well. (So too do you animals) We share control with a primitive instinct based creature who is (again according to Paul) a slave to sin. As such is doomed to die for it's sin.
January 8, 2016 at 11:58 am (This post was last modified: January 8, 2016 at 11:58 am by Drich.)
(January 8, 2016 at 11:17 am)drfuzzy Wrote:
(January 8, 2016 at 12:45 am)Sheed1980 Wrote: What u have to consider is that Allah(God) created us out of nothing.
What I mean by this is that with the big bang theory Someone had to start the big bang. So Allah decided how everything of our universe: galaxies, planets, stars, atmospheres were going to be formed from the big bang explosion. Then He simply said the word "Be" and everything came into being. I'm not saying all at once but into the process of particles becoming planets and stars etc. Then at a point in time after our Earth had been in existence for so long, as said in the Holy Qur'an, He sent His angels, messengers He created from light, to gather handfuls of earth. Black dirt, white dirt, red dirt, brown dirt and yellow dirt.(which is why we as humans come in all different colors) Then the angels mixed the dirt with water, the element that gives life, and made it a sticky clay. Then the clay was moulded into a statue which God brought to life as Adam(PBUH). So as u see since the Earth was created from absolutely nothing(big bang), and Adam(PBUH)was created from the earth, this verifies that we as mankind, like everything else Allah created, came from nothing. He created us all from nothing. So if Allah has the power to create us from ABSOLUTELY NOTHING, then after we die after having been SOMETHING, why couldn't He bring us back to life? Not to belittle Allah Almighty's power but It seems less of a miracle to bring something back to life that once existed, than to create life into existence from nothing at all. Also ur brain is not what gives life. Yes it is a very, very important factor to our living, but not the cause of life. Brain-dead people considered vegetables
still are alive until their souls are removed from their bodies. This world we live in now is temporary. We were all created for the afterlife. Eternally to reside in Paradise or Hell-fire, where life will be many, many times better or worse than we could possibly imagine. So as we are taught in the Qur'an, when u feel ur soul exiting ur body, it will be one of two ways. For a good believer(Muslim)angels with faces white as the sun come down to him from heaven with one of the shrouds of paradise and some of the perfume of paradise and sit away from him as far as the eye can see. Then the angel of death comes and sits at his head and says, ‘Good soul, come out to forgiveness and acceptance from Allah.’ It then comes out as a drop flows from a water-skin and he seizes it; and when he does so they do not leave it in his hand for an instant, but take it and place it in that shroud and that perfume, and from it there comes forth a fragrance like that of the sweetest musk found on the face of the earth. They then take it up and do not bring it past a company of angels without their asking, "Who is this good soul?’ to which they reply, ‘So and so, the son of so and so’, using the best names by which people called him on the earth. They then bring him to the lowest heaven and ask that the gate should be opened for him. This is done, and from every heaven its archangels escort him to the next heaven until it is brought to the seventh heaven, and Allah who is great and glorious says, ‘Record the book of my servant in Illiyyun and take him back to earth, for I created mankind from it, I shall return them into it, and from it I shall bring them forth another time.’ His soul is then restored to his body, two angels come to him, and making him sit up say to him, ‘ Who is our Lord’ He replies, ‘My Lord is Allah.’ They ask, ‘What is your religion?’ and he replies, ‘My religion is Islam.’ They ask, ‘Who is this man who was sent among you?’ and he replies, ‘He is Allah’s Messenger.’ They ask, ‘What is your [source of] knowledge?’ and he replies, ‘I have read Allah’s Book, believed in it and declared it to be true.’ Then one cries from heaven, ‘My servant has spoken the truth, so spread out carpets for him from paradise, and open a gate for him into paradise.’ Then some of its joy and its fragrance comes to him, his grave is made spacious for him as far as the eye can see, and a man with a beautiful face, beautiful garments and a sweet odor comes to him and says, ‘Rejoice in what pleases you for this is your day which you have been promised.’ He asks, ‘Who are you, for your face is perfectly beautiful and brings good?" He replies, ‘I am your good deeds.’ He then says, ‘My Lord, bring the last hour; my Lord, bring the last hour, so that I may return to my people and my property. For the disbeliever/wicked soul angels with black faces come down to him from heaven with hair-cloth and sit away from him as far as the eye can see. Then the angel of death comes and sits at his head and says, ‘Wicked soul, come out to displeasure from Allah.’ Then it becomes dissipated in his body, and he draws it out as a branch of thorns is pulled out from wet wool. He then seizes it, and when he does so they do not leave it in his hand for an instant, but put it in that hair-cloth and from it comes forth a stench like the most offensive corpse found on the face of the earth. They then take it up and do not bring it past a company of angels without their saying, ‘Who is this wicked soul?’ to which they reply, ‘So and so, the son of so and so’, using the worst names that he was called in the world. When he is brought to the lowest heaven request is made that the gate be opened for him, but it is not opened for him. (Allah’s Messenger (saws) then recited, ‘The gates of heaven will not be opened for them and they will not enter paradise until a camel can pass through the eye of a needle.’ Allah who is most Great and Glorious then says, ‘Record his book in Sijjin in the lowest earth,’ and his soul is thrown down. (He (saws) then recited, ‘He who assigns partners to Allah is as if he had fallen down from heaven and been snatched up by the birds, or made to fall by the wind in a place far distant.’ His soul is then restored to his body, two angels come to him, and making him sit up say to him, ‘Who is your Lord?’ He replies, ‘Alas, alas, I do not know.’ They ask, ‘What is your religion?’ He replies, ‘Alas, alas, I do not know.’ They ask ‘Who is this man who was sent among you?’ He replies, Alas, alas, I do not know.’ Then one cries out from heaven, ‘He has lied, so spread out carpets from hell for him, and open a gate for him into hell.’ Then some of its heat and hot air comes to him, his grave is made narrow for him so that his ribs are pressed together in it and a man with an ugly face, ugly garments and an offensive odor come to him and says, Be grieved with what displeases you, for this is your day which you have been promised.’ He asks ‘Who are you, for your face is most ugly and brings evil?’ He replies, ‘l am your wicked deeds.’ He then says, My Lord, do not bring the last hour.[/font][/size] [/i]
tl;dr
Allah doesn't exist. Yahweh doesn't exist. Neither does Jesus, Zeus, Mithra, Ahura-Mazda, Odin, Apollo, Osiris, Ra, Shiva, Rama, the Tooth Fairy, Santa Claus, or the Easter Bunny.
Proof?
The perceived absence of something is not proof of it...
If you read the bible from a technical POV God can be defined as an inter-dimensional being. Then it means (the part made in his image) we are as well. If we/soul are inter dimensional beings then we can exist on two different plains of existence occupying the same time and space.
I saw something on this in a documentary some where, can remember when or where.. But their is solid math that supports this theory.
A theory no different than any other based on math with no supporting physical evidence *cough higgs/boson
I think I'll take these in reverse order...
I'm pretty sure the higgs boson has been observed... higgs
Quote:Now scientists have succeeded in that observation, confirming that the particle whose discovery was announced at CERN on July 4th 2012, is indeed the long-sought-after Higgs boson.
Some documentary somewhere at some time had some supporting math? -fail
so we'll just read a centuries old book of fairy tails from a technical POV in lieu of actual current science? -fail
January 8, 2016 at 12:31 pm (This post was last modified: January 8, 2016 at 12:32 pm by Drich.)
(January 8, 2016 at 12:06 pm)mediocrates Wrote: I think I'll take these in reverse order...
I'll take these as they come.
Quote:I'm pretty sure the higgs boson has been observed... higgs
Fail- read the artical
They found leptons which have always been identifiable. The specific lepton they found, they claim is from a higgs boson decay... which in the article it self mentions their is a 1 in 10,000 chance of this being a false positive. Now to put that in perspective. their are hundreds of trillions of subatomic particles being created/destroyed by the accelerator every second. so 1 in 10,000 is a fairly high possibility of a false positive.
The scientists at cern are under alot of pressure to produce the higgs boson (after the promises they made and the billions spent) are you really so foolish to believe that a particle they themselves say decays so fast, their instruments can not detect it. so they must look for what it decays into with a 1 in 10,000 chance out of hundreds of trillion particals every second is tantamount to "Observing the Higgs/Boson."
Ah, no.. try again new sport.
Quote:Now scientists have succeeded in that observation, confirming that the particle whose discovery was announced at CERN on July 4th 2012, is indeed the long-sought-after Higgs boson.
Almost like they were being 'paid' to say that huh???
Quote:Some documentary somewhere at some time had some supporting math? -fail
so we'll just read a centuries old book of fairy tails from a technical POV in lieu of actual current science? -fail
then google it.. that All I did to chop you down to size. Don't be so lazy. If your going to refute someone do it properly!
