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RE: Even if you choose not to believe in god, you’re actually believing in god
May 31, 2016 at 10:46 am
(May 31, 2016 at 12:24 am)Blueyedlion Wrote:
Quote:MaelstromAs wise and mature as Blueyedlion wishes he was, he is still arguing his personal reality as valid over the reality in which most of us live without delusion.
How so? Everyone has their own 'personal reality' the only difference is most people are trying to figure themselves out in comparison to others, that road goes absolutely nowhere. Reality is shaped by the collective experiences of conscious choices, but no one can perceive the reason behind anyone elses choices made outside of their own. So when you judge and compare and say, this behavior is wrong regardless what i think. That behavior you are judging, is built upon so many influences, so many interactions and factors, that for you to make some sort of vague understanding of the very small amount of information available to you, will only be one side of a reality you cant imagine to piece together because you weren't the one living that experience yourself to know.
There are layers upon layers i can go much further, explaining why this relates to there being a god. But before going into that, you can already see how consciousness is the most important factor in understanding reality and oneself. If consciousness wasn't in anyway relevant then it would be easy for you to dismiss this. What does the significance of consciousness then tell you about the nature of reality? The main reason atheists don't think in this way, is because they think consciousness is a symptom of the brain, so judging just means using your brain as a tool to figure out what ever you're exposed to without restraint, and if someone is blind to what you're exposed to, or behaves in a way you wouldn't, you're then thinking 'well we both have capable brains so everyone should behave in some uniform way if we gather enough evidence - everything should exist the same way for everyone uniformly because our brains are just observing what's already there." Science already says this is wrong and yet continues to apply itself as if it agreed, all because if the scientific community were to openly admit that
consciousness manifests reality
, then god comes into play, or at least a universal mind.
And for a few main reasons i can get into some other time, that openly accepting there is likely cause of their being a god, would simply cripple their ego. Simple as that.
What . . . a . . . bunch . . . of . . . crap.
Consciousness manifests reality? The scientific community knows this? Citation please. Peer-reviewed articles only.
That should be easily testable. I think I'll go try to manifest some $$$ - my house needs a new roof.
"The family that prays together...is brainwashing their children."- Albert Einstein
RE: Even if you choose not to believe in god, you’re actually believing in god
May 31, 2016 at 12:35 pm
(May 31, 2016 at 12:24 am)Blueyedlion Wrote:
Quote:MaelstromAs wise and mature as Blueyedlion wishes he was, he is still arguing his personal reality as valid over the reality in which most of us live without delusion.
How so? Everyone has their own 'personal reality' the only difference is most people are trying to figure themselves out in comparison to others, that road goes absolutely nowhere. Reality is shaped by the collective experiences of conscious choices, but no one can perceive the reason behind anyone elses choices made outside of their own. So when you judge and compare and say, this behavior is wrong regardless what i think. That behavior you are judging, is built upon so many influences, so many interactions and factors, that for you to make some sort of vague understanding of the very small amount of information available to you, will only be one side of a reality you cant imagine to piece together because you weren't the one living that experience yourself to know.
There are layers upon layers i can go much further, explaining why this relates to there being a god. But before going into that, you can already see how consciousness is the most important factor in understanding reality and oneself. If consciousness wasn't in anyway relevant then it would be easy for you to dismiss this. What does the significance of consciousness then tell you about the nature of reality? The main reason atheists don't think in this way, is because they think consciousness is a symptom of the brain, so judging just means using your brain as a tool to figure out what ever you're exposed to without restraint, and if someone is blind to what you're exposed to, or behaves in a way you wouldn't, you're then thinking 'well we both have capable brains so everyone should behave in some uniform way if we gather enough evidence - everything should exist the same way for everyone uniformly because our brains are just observing what's already there." Science already says this is wrong and yet continues to apply itself as if it agreed, all because if the scientific community were to openly admit that consciousness manifests reality, then god comes into play, or at least a universal mind.
And for a few main reasons i can get into some other time, that openly accepting there is likely cause of their being a god, would simply cripple their ego. Simple as that.
You say science backs you: do you have any peer reviewed mainstream research backing you up? Or are you just attempting to piggyback on science by fiat?
"YOU take the hard look in the mirror. You are everything that is wrong with this world. The only thing important to you, is you." - ronedee
Want to see more of my writing? Check out my (safe for work!) site, Unprotected Sects!
RE: Even if you choose not to believe in god, you’re actually believing in god
May 31, 2016 at 1:51 pm
I don't care if there's a god, besides simple scientific curiosity, and I'm not sure why some people are so obsessed with trying to railroad people into agreement about it.
Feel free to send me a private message.
Please visit my website here! It's got lots of information about atheism/theism and support for new atheists.
RE: Even if you choose not to believe in god, you’re actually believing in god
May 31, 2016 at 4:55 pm (This post was last modified: May 31, 2016 at 4:56 pm by purplepurpose.)
(May 31, 2016 at 1:51 pm)robvalue Wrote: I don't care if there's a god, besides simple scientific curiosity, and I'm not sure why some people are so obsessed with trying to railroad people into agreement about it.
Heaven for preaching Gods will and living by it yourself. Magical profit. Calm fate can turn in to fanatical sometimes.
RE: Even if you choose not to believe in god, you’re actually believing in god
May 31, 2016 at 6:48 pm
(May 31, 2016 at 4:55 pm)purplepurpose Wrote:
(May 31, 2016 at 1:51 pm)robvalue Wrote: I don't care if there's a god, besides simple scientific curiosity, and I'm not sure why some people are so obsessed with trying to railroad people into agreement about it.
Heaven for preaching Gods will and living by it yourself. Magical profit. Calm fate can turn in to fanatical sometimes.
Yeah, there are people out there who actually believe that they will be awarded "crowns" . . . riches . . . bigger mansions . . . in heaven for saving souls. They get all ecstatic at the thought of having a bigger mansion in heaven - - apparently there will be class distinctions there too. Sky Daddy will love some of 'em better than others, in heaven just like on earth.
"The family that prays together...is brainwashing their children."- Albert Einstein
RE: Even if you choose not to believe in god, you’re actually believing in god
May 31, 2016 at 7:30 pm
(May 31, 2016 at 6:48 pm)drfuzzy Wrote: Yeah, there are people out there who actually believe that they will be awarded "crowns" . . . riches . . . bigger mansions . . . in heaven for saving souls. They get all ecstatic at the thought of having a bigger mansion in heaven - - apparently there will be class distinctions there too. Sky Daddy will love some of 'em better than others, in heaven just like on earth.
It's actually a pretty ingenious racket: sure, just being a member of the in-group will get you your reward, but if you're aggressive in attempting to expand the in-group, there's a super special extra reward waiting for you! The blanket forgiveness for sin- which christianity needs to grant in order to be necessary at all- on its own breeds complacency, and there needs to be some spice for the pot in order to make those ideas vital and infectious.
"YOU take the hard look in the mirror. You are everything that is wrong with this world. The only thing important to you, is you." - ronedee
Want to see more of my writing? Check out my (safe for work!) site, Unprotected Sects!
RE: Even if you choose not to believe in god, you’re actually believing in god
May 31, 2016 at 11:31 pm (This post was last modified: May 31, 2016 at 11:38 pm by Blueyedlion.)
(May 29, 2016 at 5:06 am)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:
(May 28, 2016 at 11:51 pm)Blueyedlion Wrote: Actually, since i'm of the opinion god is what atheists recognize as simply the universe but with an extra feature of a collective mind of all that is.
"You must first prove that this attribute exists" What is always present, the universe. tick.
Except that you haven't shown the Universe = God. Untick that box and get back to work, this time without using unfounded claims.
Allow the definition that god means a universal mind, then yes that's easily proven.
Quantum entanglement has already proven that every atom is connected to every other atom that ever was and is. Everything connects to everything else. All you have to do is apply a little logic and realize that the atoms that make up your brain are connected to every atom in everyone elses brain, and are connected to every sun and dust particle throughout the universe. Isnt that enough to demonstrate that the evidence is already there? That your mind is connected to everyone else's and to everything else?
From Article - "We think of our bodies as stable biological structures that live in the world but are fundamentally separate from it. That we are unitary organisms in the world but passing through it. But what we’re learning from the molecular processes that actually keep our bodies running is that we’re far more fluid than we realize, and the world passes through us...
...This is what a cell is about. A cell,” he said, clasping some amberjack, “is a machine for turning experience into biology.”
