Ayn Rand's philosophy of Objectivism

[brewer]

I find the thought of a community comprised of Ayn Rand's repulsive.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_j56IiLqZ9U

[Neo-Scholastic]

What I do know is that for some reason lots of people become assholes for a couple of weeks after reading Atlas Shrugged.

[bennyboy]

What I do know is that for some reason lots of people become assholes for a couple of weeks after reading Atlas Shrugged.

It's because they think they are the wolves, not the sheep. . . and it takes them 2 weeks to forget their brief ambitions and get back to their Oprah reruns.

[chimp3]

Ayn Rand clearly distinguishes self sacrifice (altruism=martyrdom) vs. benevolence.

[robvalue]

What "morality" means is the first thing to agree. Morality is ultimately a matter of opinion, because you can't draw any conclusions until you've agreed this. Even then, it's very hard to agree criteria precise enough that they're not subject to a lot of interpetation.

This Rand person is not using a definition I'd agree to. Or if she is, the defence of her position sounds very flawed. It sounds like she only values herself, ultimately.

Morality, to me, is about deciding how to act in the best interests of people in general. Looking after your own wellbeing is an important part of this, because if you're not strong enough to help others you are of no use to them.

[Thumpalumpacus]

I avoided her fiction like the plague that it was. Wooden characters, idiotic dialogue, and diarrhea of the keyboard. Polemic never makes for a good story.

[robvalue]

I'd have to actually read her stuff to be sure, but this kind of ramblings sounds like the rationalisations of a person lacking empathy.

[Lucifer]

I know people who live for other people's happiness and don't value their own needs, and I see that does not just lead to unhappiness of them, but it also troubles the people around them, including me, I don't like to see that. I would want these people to take their own needs seriously. I have tried to help a lot of people like these, but it does lead to any improvement, until they starting valuing their own lives.

And vice versa, I have also noticed that, when some people actually do start taking better care of themselves, it also makes the people around them happier, again including me.

Of course this should not mean that they ignore the needs of other people. But I think people who have empathy will always be internally motivated to help others in need.

[robvalue]

Indeed, extremes are often unhealthy in some way. If you don't care about yourself at all, that is going to have negative consequences. If you don't care about others, the same thing. Most people manage a healthy compromise between the two.

I agree, empathy is a natural motivator. I am overwhelmingly encouraged to help people, because to do otherwise would be battling myself.

That's an interesting point that if you neglect yourself to an extreme in an effort to help others, you can end up indirectly hurting others because of their concern for you. So you haven't achieved exactly what you intended.

[robvalue]

Speaking personally, I have to put a lot of time and effort into maintaining my own wellbeing. As I suffer from severe depression among other things, I am little use to anyone if I can't keep myself afloat. I can easily become a burden, in fact. So to achieve my goal of helping others, I must continue to help myself as well. So it would be immoral of me, in my opinion, to neglect myself.

I do find it rather amusing, the idea of actively doing things in order to improve my own state of mind. A kind of weird duality, where I'm trying to affect a part of me that isn't directly under my control.