Trump orders wall to be built on Mexico border

[FatAndFaithless]

I'd be more worried about the terrorists and pills, A ...but I don't worry about the things you worry about...so.... meh.

@F&F  Why -wouldn't- they hire people from an institutionally created shadow demographic whom they can exploit at a whim while the ever pervasive threat of deportation and a groundswell of racist public opinion keep them in their place?

Well, yeah, that's what I mean.  Make them face consequence if they do exploit them.  

That being said, I'd be in favor of not making them (illegals) so vulnerable in the first place with things like easy roads to citizenship.

[The Grand Nudger]

You understand that no one is going to go after businesses while there are still mexicans among us to pillory, though, yeah?  

[FatAndFaithless]

One thing I don't get is instead of spending exorbitant amounts of money in deportation and walls, why not make becoming a citizen very, very easy, cheap and fast? We'd get them socials, IDs, they'd pay taxes, etc etc. The biggest complaint I hear about immigrants is the "they take our jobs" and "they don't pay taxes" and "they're using gov't services without giving anything back." So...make it easy to become a citizen, and that kinda alleviates those problems, doesn't it? Or at least they'll be arrested if they don't pay taxes...like my uncle.

[Catholic_Lady]

Make them face consequence if they do exploit them.  

That being said, I'd be in favor of not making them (illegals) so vulnerable in the first place with things like easy roads to citizenship.

Isn't the road to citizenship already pretty reasonable? What I remember from when my parents became citizens is they had to take a citizenship test, which they received study guides for. Since I was under 18 (16) I automatically became a citizen when they did. We lived here for 9 years as legal immigrants before becoming citizens. That all seems reasonable enough to me.

How would we go about making it easier?

[Minimalist]

It would be pretty amusing to have to hire Mexicans to build it but.....

http://www.cbs5az.com/story/23089841/ari...ed-workers

Arizona construction industry has shortage of skilled workers

Kind of reminds me of the line from "A Bridge Too Far" where a British officer is giving a briefing and tells the 4 airborne division commanders: "Please understand that the one thing that is crippling all our operations is that we are desperately short of transport aircraft.  In fact, I'm surprised no one mentioned that to Monty when he dreamed this whole thing up."

And let's face it, with the WLB's record of stiffing contractors who would be stupid enough to work for him?

[Thumpalumpacus]

Well, if he manages to round one group up and confiscate their money, I see no reason why it couldn't be done again, with another group.  Maybe the aiders and abettors, to start with. That's in the order as well, ofc. Gonna be awhile before that spigot runs dry, I'm sure.

Yep -- now is the time for us to cotton to Niemoller's bon mot.

[FatAndFaithless]

Make them face consequence if they do exploit them.  

That being said, I'd be in favor of not making them (illegals) so vulnerable in the first place with things like easy roads to citizenship.

Isn't the road to citizenship already pretty reasonable? What I remember from when my parents became citizens is they had to take a citizenship test, which they received study guides for. Since I was under 18 (16) I automatically became a citizen when they did. We lived here for 9 years as legal immigrants before becoming citizens. That all seems reasonable enough to me.

How would we go about making it easier?

Honestly, I dunno.  I've no idea how arduous the citizenship process is (or isn't), but for some reason there are millions and millions of people that would rather risk deportation or dirt-poor wages rather than go through that process. Maybe they simply don't know it's a possibility, or maybe they're afraid that if they come forward to become a citizen after being illegal for a few years, that they'll be arrested anyway.

And quick question - when your parents became citizens, were they in the country legally already? If so, I imagine they didn't have to worry about any (or at least most) of the things that illegals do.

[Crossless2.0]

One thing I don't get is instead of spending exorbitant amounts of money in deportation and walls, why not make becoming a citizen very, very easy, cheap and fast?  We'd get them socials, IDs, they'd pay taxes, etc etc.  The biggest complaint I hear about immigrants is the "they take our jobs" and "they don't pay taxes" and "they're using gov't services without giving anything back."  So...make it easy to become a citizen, and that kinda alleviates those problems, doesn't it?  Or at least they'll be arrested if they don't pay taxes...like my uncle.

I suspect the unspoken answer is two-fold:

1) It's harder to exploit legal citizens than undocumented workers, and

2) 'Cause too many 'brown' people.

[abaris]

We lived here for 9 years as legal immigrants before becoming citizens. That all seems reasonable enough to me.

How would we go about making it easier?

Your parents obviously were desirables. It's not as straight forward for anyone lacking in education or skills. And it's the same in every country. We've got an opera singer, Anna Netrepko, who doesn't speak a single word of German. Got her passport in a few seconds. Others are reuquired to learn the language - which is fine, by the way, but don't get the chance if they're not needed at all.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Well let's face it -- opera singers are in great demand for the services they provide: breaking glasses with magnificent vibrato, and keeping horned-helmet manufacturers in business.