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RE: What The Hell Is Wrong With Some People
March 5, 2017 at 4:22 am
(March 3, 2017 at 11:55 am)Mister Agenda Wrote: A Theist Wrote:Good thing that a lot of other veterans don't believe or feel the same way you do.
Why is it a good thing? And a lot don't, I'm one of them.
As veteran, I don't either.
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RE: What The Hell Is Wrong With Some People
March 5, 2017 at 4:46 am
(March 2, 2017 at 12:01 pm)mlmooney89 Wrote: I know what it means to grieve a fallen soldier... I wouldn't care what Trump was using it for as long as the hero's name was being spoken all over the country he died defending.
This is the sort of thing that always leaves me puzzled.
How was he defending the U.S.A. in Yemen?
Or are the U.S. military proponents of the god old fashioned "a good defense is an offense"?
As for the wife... I wonder how many other wives, children and husbands are out there grieving their family members who died while serving in the U.S. Military... And how many of those get such a presidential invitation.
If not all, then how was this case different to warrant such an invitation?
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RE: What The Hell Is Wrong With Some People
March 5, 2017 at 8:22 am
(This post was last modified: March 5, 2017 at 8:36 am by mlmooney89.)
(March 5, 2017 at 4:46 am)pocaracas Wrote: (March 2, 2017 at 12:01 pm)mlmooney89 Wrote: I know what it means to grieve a fallen soldier... I wouldn't care what Trump was using it for as long as the hero's name was being spoken all over the country he died defending.
This is the sort of thing that always leaves me puzzled.
How was he defending the U.S.A. in Yemen?
Or are the U.S. military proponents of the god old fashioned "a good defense is an offense"?
As for the wife... I wonder how many other wives, children and husbands are out there grieving their family members who died while serving in the U.S. Military... And how many of those get such a presidential invitation.
If not all, then how was this case different to warrant such an invitation?
Poca that question infuriates me and I refuse to answer it again. Saying that a soldier didn't give his life for his country is the quickest way to get on my shit list. And no military family member thinks it's plausible to honor every fallen soldier like that yet we need to honor them in honoring the ones we can. This gentleman was not only a Navy Seal (arguably one of the best... Groups I reckon you could call them but I'm biased because my father was an Army Ranger and we joke that Navy Seals have heroes too and they are the Rangers but that's just inner military joking) but he has multiple bronze stars meaning that he earned a deceased hero's welcome home. No good soldier (or equivalent ie marine, air man, etc) would begrudge a fallen soldier that just because they didn't get one. My father wasn't honored by the president but I felt no less pride in everything he stood for and did in his life standing there next to his flag draped coffin.
(March 3, 2017 at 12:50 pm)Faith No More Wrote: Of course, if Trump really wanted to honor her sacrifice, he could make sure she never has to worry about putting food on her table or even help fund one of the numerous organizations that help out veterans and their spouses in her name. But that wouldn't be as ostentatious and get him that sweet round of applause.
The government does support the family of those that have fallen... At least they helped us. My parents weren't married to each other anymore and yet every month a check came in my name to the care of my mother until I turned 18. My father himself didn't have a will so all of his personal stuff went to my step mom who didn't even look my direction. Luckily the government didn't look over the daughter of a deceased vet. Also I could have gone to college for free if I had wanted to under the Hazelwood Act but that was more of a Texas thing I don't know if all states have that.
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RE: What The Hell Is Wrong With Some People
March 5, 2017 at 9:12 am
(March 5, 2017 at 8:22 am)mlmooney89 Wrote: (March 5, 2017 at 4:46 am)pocaracas Wrote: This is the sort of thing that always leaves me puzzled.
How was he defending the U.S.A. in Yemen?
Or are the U.S. military proponents of the god old fashioned "a good defense is an offense"?
As for the wife... I wonder how many other wives, children and husbands are out there grieving their family members who died while serving in the U.S. Military... And how many of those get such a presidential invitation.
If not all, then how was this case different to warrant such an invitation?
Poca that question infuriates me and I refuse to answer it again. Saying that a soldier didn't give his life for his country is the quickest way to get on my shit list. And no military family member thinks it's plausible to honor every fallen soldier like that yet we need to honor them in honoring the ones we can. This gentleman was not only a Navy Seal (arguably one of the best... Groups I reckon you could call them but I'm biased because my father was an Army Ranger and we joke that Navy Seals have heroes too and they are the Rangers but that's just inner military joking) but he has multiple bronze stars meaning that he earned a deceased hero's welcome home. No good soldier (or equivalent ie marine, air man, etc) would begrudge a fallen soldier that just because they didn't get one. My father wasn't honored by the president but I felt no less pride in everything he stood for and did in his life standing there next to his flag draped coffin.
I guess I knew that was coming...
Maybe I'm biased... maybe my definition of defense is wrong... maybe you're biased for being in a military family...
but... my understanding is that when you defend a country, you are in that country defending it from an invading force.
When you're in some other country... unless that other country asked for your help (in which case you're there to defend that other country, not your own), you are an invading force, not a defending one.
My qualm was with the wording "defending your country" and not with any heroism or honor or ability to follow orders that the individual person had.
I'm sure there's some gray area in what concerns international terrorism, but can terrorists pose that much of a threat to a country like the U.S. that you'd have to hunt them down in every corner of the world?
I guess I'm questioning the whole approach (from the politicians to the military top brass), but also the likely biased patriotic view that Americans are fed (by those in power) so they can stand behind all these international military endeavors, instead of opposing them as invasions of other countries.
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RE: What The Hell Is Wrong With Some People
March 5, 2017 at 10:49 am
(March 2, 2017 at 11:51 am)A Theist Wrote: The widow of fallen Navy Seal hero, Carryn Owens, was invited by President Trump to be present in the audience to honor the memory of her husband, Ryan Owens, at his first address to Congress. Owens' grieving and heartbroken widow was received with applause and a standing ovation by everyone in Congress. There didn't seem to be many dry eyes there, even the Generals in uniform were moved.
But, hateful, uncaring, inhuman, filthy pieces of shit took it upon themselves to not only politicize this event but even had the lowest form of indecency to attack the widow herself! It all went beyond poor taste, to stir up a controversy just because she was invited to attend President Trump's address to Congress and to be present while the memory of her husband was being honored. It was cruel and inhuman.
Quote:A former Hillary Clinton volunteer drew swift condemnation -- and lost his job -- after mocking the widow of a fallen Navy SEAL who was honored by the president during his congressional address Tuesday night.
Dan Grilo, who said in his Twitter profile that he was a former volunteer for both Hillary Clinton and President Barack Obama, made the remarks after Trump paid tribute to Carryn Owens. She is the widow of U.S. Navy SEAL William “Ryan” Owens, who was killed in a counterterrorism raid in Yemen last month.
“Sorry, Owens' wife, you’re not helping yourself or your husband’s memory by standing there and clapping like an idiot. Trump just used you.”
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/03/...-seal.html
...and Michael Moore
The way I see it she was a prop, nothing more. I think Trump used her to politicize the event. I did not vote for Trump but I want him to succeed, I just don't see any evidence of it yet.
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RE: What The Hell Is Wrong With Some People
March 5, 2017 at 10:55 am
(This post was last modified: March 5, 2017 at 10:59 am by Anomalocaris.)
(March 5, 2017 at 10:49 am)Manowar Wrote: The way I see it she was a prop, nothing more. I think Trump used her to politicize the event. I did not vote for Trump but I want him to succeed, I just don't see any evidence of it yet.
Manowar
Presidents succeed or fail.
But the essential epoch making distinction between the trump and other fake president yet to come, and all previous, real, presidents is while trump's failure will still inevitably be the country's failure, trump's success would not be the country's success. So we are screwed.
The seed of this was planted with the Gingrich/delay republican revolution of 1994, but it is bearing its bitter fruit now.
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RE: What The Hell Is Wrong With Some People
March 5, 2017 at 12:12 pm
(March 3, 2017 at 8:37 am)A Theist Wrote: (March 2, 2017 at 11:51 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: What's this? An American president grandstanding on the grave of a fallen serviceman? Stop the goddamned presses, this is news.
The world will be a better place when our Presidents see these sacrifices as losses and not photo ops. Is that what it is, Thump? Presidents just grandstanding over the graves of fallen soldiers and taking advantage of their sacrifices for photo ops? How do you know that for sure? Isn't it also possible that our presidents are and were sincere in paying tribute and bestowing honor on our wounded and fallen soldiers?
It is possible but for Trump, it's highly improbable. Deep down A-Theist, you know I am right.
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RE: What The Hell Is Wrong With Some People
March 5, 2017 at 1:01 pm
(March 3, 2017 at 11:55 am)Mister Agenda Wrote: A Theist Wrote:Good thing that a lot of other veterans don't believe or feel the same way you do.
Why is it a good thing? And a lot don't, I'm one of them.
As am I. I don't hold it against her, but politicians scoring cheap political points off of service members deaths is contemptible no matter who does it.
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