Hadiths and deceivers.

[downbeatplumb]

If you going to trust "Sahih" hadiths, yes, they are going to have a poison against Mohammad that absolutely would prove him evil if they were true.

The people who took the position of political, religious, and all levels of leadership, didn't believe in Mohammad, but just as previous revelations were distorted by the very deceivers who the books came to expose and counter with a real genuine leadership to balance the world out, and bring balance and justice to the world by exposing these deceivers and their falsehood,  yes, Islam was also infiltrated.

This includes Sunni and Shiite hadiths. 

There is poison in both of them. But don't be afraid of hadiths from any one to fall in your cup, for if one wing of a fly is poison, in the other is the cure.

The hadiths although filled with poison are also faced with insights. I suggest ignoring the rating of "good" "authentic" "weak" "established" "trusted" or "fabricated" and rather, only go them if you seek insights into Quran. That is they are only useful to perceives things in Quran and to compliment the Quran and when use towards other, to reinforce a proper interpretation of Quran that is proved by Quran but you start with the hadith to show the view, to show it's not your own and has proof in the legacy of those who knew the Quran best, lest every persons just babbles about the Quran with no proof what so ever claiming they have the right interpretation.

Weren't you going to expressly not do this sort of thing.
Talk to us about shopping or something. When you try religious stuff it doesn't work.

[Angrboda]

How does belief in design lead to belief in a specific book?  You're using design as a sign of confirmation after the fact of already having taken the leap to believe in the Quran, but you believed in that specific book first.  How does design uniquely point to this book rather than that one?

No; the "leap" is the step taken after the observation takes place.
First, you notice something strange about the world and about the universe.
Second, you begin to search for explanations. One of the explanations is stated in the Quran.

There are so many explanations out there, rejecting all explanations is what you are: atheism.

Personally; I take the explanation in the Quran for the design to be a perfect sign of confirmation: the design led me to search, the found explanation led me to believe that the design served a purpose, both are dependent on each other.

So why aren't you then a Christian? Or a Jew? Or a Hindu? These all have creation stories. What you are saying doesn't make sense. On top of that, creation stories are so common, it's like saying that because the bible mentions Egypt, a real place, then the rest of it is true. Design gets you to a generic god; to go further and conclude the God of the Quran, you have to add something that isn't there.

[robvalue]

Absolutely. No one, not even Muslims, approach other books this way. If it contains some things that are true, we don’t assume everything else the book says is true.

I think religious people often start with the assumption that there must be one flawless book from god somewhere. If that was the case (baseless though it is) the time to make that judgement would be after a book has been shown to be flawless, not after some parts of it have been shown as such.

[The Grand Nudger]

Additionally, what use is a leap of faith if you have a credible argument, and what use is a credible argument if you're making a leap of faith?

In this case, the leap of faith IS the credible argument.

That, is an impressive misunderstanding of credible argumentation.

In life we take lots of "leaps of faith", even when our lives are the thing at stake.

If you say so, but that doesn't make those leaps "arguments", so...............?  

Let me give you an example: flying. All of us ride plains, but do you know that there is always a chance of 1 in every 11 Million do die.
For cars, it's 1 for every 5000 car crashes. But there is a chance.

My "leap of faith" is based on this 1 in 11 Million. And guess what? planes DO crash, and accidents DO happen. So when we take the matter of "rare odds"; it is not quite wrong or illogical to carry the stand I take; that's why you have a seat belt in your car. Who should I believe, you or the engineer working at Mustang? If I believed you; I might fly out of the window someday due to an accident because "Khem and his buddies declined the 1 in 5000 accident possibility"..

Ah, the good ole bet hedging strategy of belief.  I'm sure it'll work out, and that the lord of creation won't see directly through that nonsense and fill your anus with molten lead or whatever he does on tuesdays.  

[Edwardo Piet]

How does belief in design lead to belief in a specific book?... How does design uniquely point to this book rather than that one?

Indeed. Even the Scholastics knew better than attempt to link natural revelations directly with special ones.

Huh. I thought you were a Christian? Does this mean that you admit there's no line of logic that leads you to your specific book? Logic may, in your misinformed opinion, get you to deism, but the specific religion you choose... you just take on faith?

[WinterHold]

No; the "leap" is the step taken after the observation takes place.
First, you notice something strange about the world and about the universe.
Second, you begin to search for explanations. One of the explanations is stated in the Quran.

There are so many explanations out there, rejecting all explanations is what you are: atheism.

Personally; I take the explanation in the Quran for the design to be a perfect sign of confirmation: the design led me to search, the found explanation led me to believe that the design served a purpose, both are dependent on each other.

So why aren't you then a Christian?  Or a Jew?  Or a Hindu?  These all have creation stories.  What you are saying doesn't make sense.  On top of that, creation stories are so common, it's like saying that because the bible mentions Egypt, a real place, then the rest of it is true.  Design gets you to a generic god; to go further and conclude the God of the Quran, you have to add something that isn't there.

Because their creation stories did not make any sense to me.
Take Genesis: earth was dark, then God added light.
Where does it say that God created the darkness itself? what made me believe in the Quran is this exact thought: it specifies that God made everything including the darkness itself; declared explicitly in this verse:

Sura 17, The Quran:
( 12 )   And We have made the night and day two signs, and We erased the sign of the night and made the sign of the day visible that you may seek bounty from your Lord and may know the number of years and the account [of time]. And everything We have set out in detail.

Where is that in Genesis? God there is a God of "light"; a God missing the ability to make darkness, he found it already covering earth -that is more of a side effect??-, while the God of the Quran is the creator of both darkness and light, Sura 17 verse 12 says that.

God in the Quran is more complete. And that's what can convince me: perfection.

Hindu Gods and Jesus as a lord are very...humanoids?

[Mystic]

The Quran explains Genesis quite well. I will make a thread about this, the commentary of Quran on genesis and exodus.

[The Grand Nudger]

Other divine creation stories don't make sense, but magic books divine creation story....does...?

[Mystic]

The genesis makes sense, it's not literal.

[The Grand Nudger]

Then it's not a creation story in any relevant sense.  It's a poem about....whatever.