Atheist Bible Study 1: Genesis

[Angrboda]

I thought Lot had parted ways by this point? This is why I don't read fiction. I have trouble following plot twists.

[Bahana]

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0060164/ Here's an interesting movie from the 60s (called The Bible: In the Beginning...) that has the "bring out your men" scene with Lot. The acting is over the top but I find it entertaining.

[GrandizerII]

I thought Lot had parted ways by this point?  This is why I don't read fiction.  I have trouble following plot twists.

Well, he was living in Sodom when he was taken hostage, and then (I assume) returned to Sodom after he was rescued.

[Drich]

Drich

bla bla bla

There is no evidence anywhere that Israel existed at all before about 1200 BCE. They were a tribal confederation until the first king.
There is not one shred of evidence for Abraham, (according to the best of the Israeli archeologists).
He was an entirely mythical figure. Applying dates to mythological figures, (Abraham and Moses) has no foundation in fact ... at all.
Abraham was a myth as well as Moses. There is evidence for neither. No one can actually write about their own death and burial, (Moses).  
He would have no way of "going down" to Egypt, as camels had not been domesticated yet, nor would anyone else, (ie Joseph).
Actually my comments covers the entire period of Israeli history. None of my POINTS were refuted, thus you attempt to fling your poo "around the subject",
yet never actually address any of it it. You are SO hilariously transparent.
Subtle you ain't.

You still haven't told us why you chose the *CB* (Christian Bully) approach to evangelization, over others.
Why ... if I didn't know better, I might just think you're nothing but an angry old troll who gets off by insulting people.
That can't be, could it ?
Jesus sure has done *you* a lot of good, I see.  

I think you have a play-date waiting.
Now run along outside and play.

glob...

which is why I told you you are about 900 years too early with your last and this argument. because israel was not a nation before the exodus. they were bedouin semites. which there are tns ofevidncefor in egypt.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFfzWL1NXdE&t=23s

---

Abram vs. Lot
Genesis 13

Back in Canaan, a now very wealthy Abram goes up to the Negev, then back to Bethel, with Lot accompanying him. Now Lot was also a wealthy man, with a great number of possessions and an abundance of livestock. This meant that there were bound to be arguments between Abram's men and Lot's men over land and livestock and such. Wanting to diffuse the quarreling, Abram made an agreement with Lot that they separate, with Lot going one way and picking a region of land to his liking, while Abram went a different way. And that is what they did. Lot chose the whole plain of the Jordan to the east, where he pitched near Sodom. Abram, on the other hand, stayed in the land of Canaan, pitching near the great trees of Mamre at Hebron (and building yet another altar to the LORD). And thus, problem solved.

Note: Lot is meant to be an integral character in the later story of Sodom and Gomorrah. Hence, the separation of Lot from Abram, and his settling near Sodom.

Also, after Abram and Lot part ways, God had this to say to Abram:

"Look around from where you are, to the north and south, to the east and west. All the land that you see I will give to you and your offspring forever. I will make your offspring like the dust of the earth, so that if anyone could count the dust, then your offspring could be counted. Go, walk through the length and breadth of the land, for I am giving it to you."

Thus, God's stamp of approval to Canaan belonging to Abram and his descendants (the Israelites). And bloody wars continue to be fought because of that. Thanks, God.

 

can you name a society who is established without any bloody war?

[TwoKnives99]

I thought Lot had parted ways by this point?  This is why I don't read fiction.  I have trouble following plot twists.

Well, he was living in Sodom when he was taken hostage, and then (I assume) returned to Sodom after he was rescued.

Bloody hell. There are more plot twists *cough* inconsistencies *cough* in Genesis than there are in a Christopher Nolan movie. 

On a side note though... John G. Gammie published an article in the Journal of Biblical Literature back in 1971, where, in a portion, he discussed Genesis 14:18-20 He said : 

'There is virtually unanimous opinion among scholars that vss. 18-20 were not of originally a piece with the rest of Genesis 14 ' [1] He refers to an earlier article by Swiss theologian Walther Zimmerli, which states that even though Genesis 14:18-20 is an interpolation, it profoundly alters the understanding of both verses 1-17 and 21-24 and John G. Gammie writes 'the effect of the interpolation is to make El 'Elyon i.e. Yahweh appear as the ultimate source of Abraham's accomplishments.' 

Big Yahweh stealing all the credit. 

[1] Preview of John G. Gammie's article

[Crossless2.0]

 

can you name a society who is established without any bloody war?

The Harappan civilization might be a contender.

[Angrboda]

 

can you name a society who is established without any bloody war?

The Harappan civilization might be a contender.

I don't know if I can name one, but undoubtedly there were many because at one time the earth was sufficiently sparsely populated that competition was unnecessary. The first cities some 10,000 years ago likely did not involve any conflict in their formation. I suspect this is just another vapid generalization from moron central.

[Crossless2.0]

The Harappan civilization might be a contender.

I don't know if I can name one, but undoubtedly there were many because at one time the earth was sufficiently sparsely populated that competition was unnecessary. The first cities some 10,000 years ago likely did not involve any conflict in their formation. I suspect this is just another vapid generalization from moron central.

Fortunately for both of us, we don’t have to defend the Bible as some sort of gold standard for civilized values.

As far as Harappan civilization goes, the pre-Aryan settlers of the Indus Valley present an intriguing possibility, given the notable absence of war iconography, weapons, or armor among archaeological finds, but its origins appear to be too murky to come to a conclusive judgement on the question.

[Minimalist]

Caral-Supe in Peru.  Archaeologists, you know, real scholars not these bible thumping asswipes, have found no evidence of weapons or battlements.

[Bucky Ball]

glob...

which is why I told you you are about 900 years too early with your last and this argument. because israel was not a nation before the exodus. they were bedouin semites. which there are tns ofevidncefor in egypt.

A YouTube video by a hack who is totally out of touch with the consensus of historians is evidence (much less "proof") of absolutely nothing.
Of course there were Semitic settlements. There is NOT ONE SHRED of evidence, accepted by historians, that these Semites were ever in Egypt in any "number" AND the "exodus" makes no sense ... Egypt CONTROLLED Canaan ... going from one place they control to another they control to escape, is ludicrous. Israeli archaeologists, who would have the most to gain, deny there is any truth to the "exodus", and you have none.

Now run along and play with the other Fundy simple-minded children.
You can take up your crap fake history with Israeli archaeologists, sport.