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Question for Christians and Muslims
February 4, 2019 at 9:06 am
If someone offered to give you $100 000 and in order to get the money all you had to do is yell in a private room "I love Satan more than Jesus Christ and Satan is so much better than God!" would you do it? Of course if you're Muslim you would say 'prophet Muhammad' instead of 'Jesus' and 'Allah' instead of 'God'.
Again just to repeat you would not have to yell this in public nor being recorded by video or audio.
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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RE: Question for Christians and Muslims
February 4, 2019 at 9:13 am
You can get a Hollander (Michigan) to do it for 20 bucks.....
A deal's a deal....
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RE: Question for Christians and Muslims
February 4, 2019 at 9:15 am
nope, wouldn't do it regardless of the amount, or what that money would do for my family.
"There ought to be a term that would designate those who actually follow the teachings of Jesus, since the word 'Christian' has been largely divorced from those teachings, and so polluted by fundamentalists that it has come to connote their polar opposite: intolerance, vindictive hatred, and bigotry." -- Philip Stater, Huffington Post
always working on cleaning my windows- me regarding Johari
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RE: Question for Christians and Muslims
February 4, 2019 at 9:20 am
Fake, you need to grow the hell up. Just because you will betray your principles for some cash doesn't mean that everyone will. But it does remind me of a joke.
A man asks a beautiful young woman if she will sleep with him for one million dollars.
"For a million bucks?", she responds. "Yeah, I'd do that."
"Good. Now that we've established that you're a whore, let's negotiate the price."
We do not inherit the world from our parents. We borrow it from our children.
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RE: Question for Christians and Muslims
February 5, 2019 at 1:43 am
No, to deny the truth is to betray one's self. God would know and for Christians that is all that matters. What good would money do a person in hell, can't buy your way out and besides there's nothing there to spend it on. In heaven money is no good either, the streets are paved in gold. Only those with a low self esteem would deem this question as important.
GC
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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RE: Question for Christians and Muslims
February 5, 2019 at 6:42 am
(This post was last modified: February 5, 2019 at 7:41 am by Anomalocaris.)
(February 4, 2019 at 9:06 am)Fake Messiah Wrote: If someone offered to give you $100 000 and in order to get the money all you had to do is yell in a private room "I love Satan more than Jesus Christ and Satan is so much better than God!" would you do it? Of course if you're Muslim you would say 'prophet Muhammad' instead of 'Jesus' and 'Allah' instead of 'God'.
Again just to repeat you would not have to yell this in public nor being recorded by video or audio.
Yes. I am getting something I can put to good use at zero cost.
(February 4, 2019 at 9:20 am)Yonadav Wrote: Fake, you need to grow the hell up. Just because you will betray your principles for some cash doesn't mean that everyone will. But it does remind me of a joke.
A man asks a beautiful young woman if she will sleep with him for one million dollars.
"For a million bucks?", she responds. "Yeah, I'd do that."
"Good. Now that we've established that you're a whore, let's negotiate the price."
Just as tackattack and gc put their creed into disrepute by professing unconditional devotion in defiance of the good that meaningless superficial play acting repudiation can purchase, so setting abstract principles truly beyond price betrays the lack of understanding of an automaton of why principle actually can be a good thing, much less any ability to begin to put their good into the context of any greater good. Those who truly put principles beyond price are enslaved by the principle, rather than have command of their principle so as to make principle serve any good.
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RE: Question for Christians and Muslims
February 5, 2019 at 8:36 am
(This post was last modified: February 5, 2019 at 8:46 am by Brian37.)
(February 4, 2019 at 9:15 am)tackattack Wrote: nope, wouldn't do it regardless of the amount, or what that money would do for my family.
That's silly. It is possible to say things you don't mean. And lets say you needed that money for a loved one's heart operation or cancer therapy?
Pretty silly to say considering you have zero evidence for your god claim, or a Satan for that matter.
If someone offered me $100,000 to denounce Yoda, I'd do it in a heartbeat.
Because in both cases, my morality isn't coming from old mythology or fiction.
On the other hand, I would give any amount of money to have my late mother still alive. And unlike any old mythological deity, I would not sell my provable cat for any amount of money.
But if some sucker wants to give me $100,000 to say that sure, because it really would have no affect on me in reality.
Your post here is what scares me about my fellow human's bad use of logic.
Most humans are good, but unfortunately at the same time, are sold at birth utopias that do not exist, and are willing to defend things solely on tradition, desire, and tribalism.
It is absurd that you'd hedge your bets on things you'd have no evidence for, when the pragmatic person could take that money and use it for real living humans here and now, like family, friends and the good of society now.
If words had magic powers, in the context of superstition, then anyone who picks on ABBA will be smote, struck down by Thor.
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RE: Question for Christians and Muslims
February 5, 2019 at 9:12 am
(This post was last modified: February 5, 2019 at 9:20 am by The Grand Nudger.)
One imagines that the lord of the cosmos and author of the human condition would understand saying some words for 100k. If anybody's dangling money for me to say "Fuck murrica, canadia is better!" you can just go ahead and write the check. Relieving some dunce of a hundred k isn't exactly a betrayal of any of my principles and it doesn't change the fact that murrica is the best or that canadia sucks.
(February 5, 2019 at 8:36 am)Brian37 Wrote: If words had magic powers, in the context of superstition, then anyone who picks on ABBA will be smote, struck down by Thor.
Exactly this. If the superstitious really believed in any of their nonsense they'd be furiously rubbing every lamp they could find and carrying a board around to knock themselves unconscious every time they had the slightest hint of an untoward thought. Lest it imperil their immortal souls.
They aren't....because they don't. In reality, they "say the magic words" and "betray their principles" and then donate some portion of the proceeds to their superstition club to launder their consciences. American christians aren't exactly giving their shit away and flinging themselves headlong into a brotherly socialist utopia, for example.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Question for Christians and Muslims
February 5, 2019 at 11:41 am
It is dangerous to hold to your principles unwaveringly. It makes me narrow minded in some things, and I'll readily admit that. I could also say out loud that "God is not real" and "God is really Satan" because I don't believe blasphemy is with the tongue, but with that heart. It's not for my belief in God that I wouldn't take the bet, it for my principles on living with the gains of my actions. It's the same reason I wouldn't prostitute myself for money, or take money I find on the street; I didn't do anything worth earning it. Principles for people are axiomatic to the subjective self in the same way that there are universal laws of physics, etc. I don't hedge my bets on principles. Do you hedge your bets that 2+2=4 or that the color green is not purple? Just because my evidence doesn't meet your standards, or that you don't accept it as evidence,doesn't make it any less real for me. I am very pragamtist and realist in a lot of things in my life. Principles are not one of those things, I know what I believe and why I believe it, where a lot of my faults lie and how far I'd go in a lot of scenarios.
If the OP would restate the OP to say You have no way of saving your family trapped in another room, and they will die if you don't privately profess your love of Thor from another room. I would do that. It wouldn't affect anyone other than me and God knows my heart. If I had to do that in front of my family and there was truly no way to save any of us, I hope my family would forgive me for not doing it.
"There ought to be a term that would designate those who actually follow the teachings of Jesus, since the word 'Christian' has been largely divorced from those teachings, and so polluted by fundamentalists that it has come to connote their polar opposite: intolerance, vindictive hatred, and bigotry." -- Philip Stater, Huffington Post
always working on cleaning my windows- me regarding Johari
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RE: Question for Christians and Muslims
February 5, 2019 at 11:56 am
(This post was last modified: February 5, 2019 at 12:00 pm by Anomalocaris.)
(February 5, 2019 at 11:41 am)tackattack Wrote: It is dangerous to hold to your principles unwaveringly. It makes me narrow minded in some things, and I'll readily admit that. I could also say out loud that "God is not real" and "God is really Satan" because I don't believe blasphemy is with the tongue, but with that heart. It's not for my belief in God that I wouldn't take the bet, it for my principles on living with the gains of my actions. It's the same reason I wouldn't prostitute myself for money, or take money I find on the street; I didn't do anything worth earning it. Principles for people are axiomatic to the subjective self in the same way that there are universal laws of physics, etc. I don't hedge my bets on principles. Do you hedge your bets that 2+2=4 or that the color green is not purple? Just because my evidence doesn't meet your standards, or that you don't accept it as evidence,doesn't make it any less real for me. I am very pragamtist and realist in a lot of things in my life. Principles are not one of those things, I know what I believe and why I believe it, where a lot of my faults lie and how far I'd go in a lot of scenarios.
If the OP would restate the OP to say You have no way of saving your family trapped in another room, and they will die if you don't privately profess your love of Thor from another room. I would do that. It wouldn't affect anyone other than me and God knows my heart. If I had to do that in front of my family and there was truly no way to save any of us, I hope my family would forgive me for not doing it.
Really? This is all you’ve got to justify pretending an intelligent human could not make more practical good out of $100,000 than to more than offset the zero harm that would come from utter a statement that he regards as untrue but which no one would hear?
If shouting 2+2=bizallion nets me $100,000, then 2+2=4 will remain true and hold me no grudge, unlike your petty and never-real-to-begin-with god, if I shout 2+2=bizallion.
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