(July 16, 2016 at 6:59 pm)paulpablo Wrote: This might have already been mentioned but the truck didn't run over just French people.  From reports I've seen British, American, Russian, Moroccan.

Does it matter what label the victims have? They were human and now they're dead.

The saddest thing about it, not even the tightest security can prevent an act like this. Trucks or cars aren't considered weapons. So what will they do as long as the driver isn't already on the radar?

Exactly: no amount of surveillance will prevent all attacks. People get upset at the amount of surveillance and attacks 'slip through the net' anyway. People are more likely to die on the roads (in a car accident) than in a terrorist attack but somehow we must suspend our freedoms and let the terrorists terrorize us.

(July 17, 2016 at 5:49 am)MrNoMorePropaganda Wrote: Exactly: no amount of surveillance will prevent all attacks. People get upset at the amount of surveillance and attacks 'slip through the net' anyway. People are more likely to die on the roads (in a car accident) than in a terrorist attack but somehow we must suspend our freedoms and let the terrorists terrorize us.

Some security measures are necessary. Such as keeping it tight on airports and before boarding a plane.

Some security measures simply don't work. Such as indiscriminate data collection, since the services are drowning in information which they can't process anymore.

And some attacks, such as this one - driving a truck into soft targets - will never be prevented. They couldn't very well cage in the whole Cornige.

(July 16, 2016 at 8:36 pm)abaris Wrote:

(July 16, 2016 at 6:59 pm)paulpablo Wrote: This might have already been mentioned but the truck didn't run over just French people.  From reports I've seen British, American, Russian, Moroccan.

Does it matter what label the victims have? They were human and now they're dead.

The saddest thing about it, not even the tightest security can prevent an act like this. Trucks or cars aren't considered weapons. So what will they do as long as the driver isn't already on the radar?

I'm pointing out that the title of the thread is factually wrong. They weren't all French people.

I agree they were all human.

I disagree that there's nothing that could have been done security wise to prevent an attack like this.

Deporting immigrants who commit violent crimes could have prevented this attack, he had a police record for violence before the attack.

(July 17, 2016 at 8:05 am)paulpablo Wrote: Deporting immigrants who commit violent crimes could have prevented this attack, he had a police record for violence before the attack.

And then another born French citizen would have jumped in, given that this probably has been organised by outside forces.

The Charlie Hebdo killers were French, after all.

It's the kind of attack that matter, not the perp. You can't stop a truck by security measures, short of caging the whole celebration in.

(July 17, 2016 at 8:07 am)abaris Wrote:

(July 17, 2016 at 8:05 am)paulpablo Wrote: Deporting immigrants who commit violent crimes could have prevented this attack, he had a police record for violence before the attack.

And then another born French citizen would have jumped in, given that this probably has been organised by outside forces.

The Charlie Hebdo killers were French, after all.

It's the kind of attack that matter, not the perp. You can't stop a truck by security measures, short of caging the whole celebration in.

Not necessarily true that another French citizen would jump in.  It's possible, but it's also possible that if this organization had other desperate Muslims wanting to be involved then they would have involved them already and synchronized their efforts.

The Charlie Hedbo killings could have also been stopped by deportation or similar security measures.  

Just read through newspaper reports about these two Charlie Hedbo terrorists.  Arrested for trying to go to Syria to fight in terrorist cell groups.  In court one of them says he wants to attack Jewish targets in France.  One of them was arrested for trying to help another Islamic terrorist break out of prison.

How many warning signs do you need?

These two are poster boys for people who should be deported/exiled, the only reason they had for being in France was to attack at some point, intelligence services knew who they were and imprisoned one for 3 and a half years.

And at the end of all the arrests and statements about wanting to kill people in France and trying to break people out of prison, they reside in a suburb in France.

It's the equivalent of inviting people in to have sex with your wife while you hold her hair back for them then complaining you didn't expect them to do it that hard.

(July 17, 2016 at 8:46 am)paulpablo Wrote: The Charlie Hedbo killings could have also been stopped by deportation or similar security measures.  

How exactly do you deport a citizen?

(July 17, 2016 at 8:52 am)abaris Wrote:

(July 17, 2016 at 8:46 am)paulpablo Wrote: The Charlie Hedbo killings could have also been stopped by deportation or similar security measures.  

How exactly do you deport a citizen?

I said "or by similar security measures", exile, anything that gets them out of the country.  

I'm not claiming to be an expert of law but I find it hard to believe that it's correct to say that security measures couldn't possibly stop two people who live in Paris who are arrested and imprisoned for being terrorists, who also state "I'd like to kill Jewish people in Paris" and they then manage to get machine guns while living in the capital city of France.

Security can't be tighter than that?

Couldn't possibly be tighter than allowing convicted terrorists live in the capital city of the country they want to terrorize.

I have seen reports that the guy emptied hos personal bank account and gave it to the family. And according to his brother 100k wasn't the kind of money he had.

(July 17, 2016 at 9:04 am)paulpablo Wrote: I said "or by similar security measures", exile, anything that gets them out of the country.  

Exile? OK, where to?