(May 16, 2019 at 2:14 pm)CDF47 Wrote: I am against murder.  I am a Christian.  I do not dream up ways of murdering people.  Just because I said a bullet is lethal does not mean I dream up ways of murdering someone.

Obviously you're not a historian.

(May 16, 2019 at 2:27 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 2:14 pm)CDF47 Wrote: I am against murder.  I am a Christian.  I do not dream up ways of murdering people.  Just because I said a bullet is lethal does not mean I dream up ways of murdering someone.

Obviously you're not a historian.

I am talking about myself personally.  Not talking about history.

(May 16, 2019 at 12:52 pm)CDF47 Wrote: The 2nd amendment should never change.  It was not intended to.  It is prevent tyranny primarily.

Boru

(May 16, 2019 at 2:30 pm)CDF47 Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 2:27 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Obviously you're not a historian.

I am talking about myself personally.  Not talking about history.

You implied that you were against murder and didn't dream up ways of killing people because you are a christian. LOL

(May 16, 2019 at 12:53 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 12:52 pm)CDF47 Wrote: The 2nd amendment should never change.  It was not intended to.  It is prevent tyranny primarily.

That makes you an anti-constitutionalist.

No shit, if the founders set it in stone, then they wouldn't have written into it a way to add or remove amendments.

All this proves to me, is that CD is not interested in problem solving, but protecting his own ego.

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(May 16, 2019 at 2:36 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 2:30 pm)CDF47 Wrote: I am talking about myself personally.  Not talking about history.

You implied that you were against murder and didn't dream up ways of killing people because you are a christian. LOL

Invent a hero motif, regardless of logical fallacies, and you can get desperate humans to follow you off of a cliff.

I will only say that there is not one religion who owns the sole patent on gullibility.

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(May 16, 2019 at 2:36 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 12:52 pm)CDF47 Wrote: The 2nd amendment should never change.  It was not intended to.  It is prevent tyranny primarily.

Boru

And funny that, the God character had no problem killing the Egyptian firstborn, or drowning toddlers and pregnant women in a flood.

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(May 16, 2019 at 2:14 pm)CDF47 Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 12:56 pm)Brian37 Wrote: You have the same bullshit attitude as a drunk driver. You pick up a firearm a few times and stupidly figure nothing will ever go wrong. Just like a drunk driver gets away with driving drunk and makes it home. Firearms are not forgiving no matter what your intent is. You pull that trigger, there is no rewind like a DVR or reset like an X-Box.

That is why gun safety is so critical as well as knowing the four gun safety rules.

https://www.hunter-ed.com/blog/4-essenti...rm-safety/

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(May 16, 2019 at 12:57 pm)Aegon Wrote: You must have very high blood pressure.

I have anxiety problems but blood pressure is normal actually.

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(May 16, 2019 at 1:14 pm)Brian37 Wrote: You are the part of my species evolution I cant stand. How nice of you to talk of "lethal" as if killing a fellow human being with a firearm is something to be admired. It sucks that humans fight, but I hate that side of my species that dream up ways to murder each other.

Do humans need weapons? YES, and unfortunately so. But it is a bullshit attitude that weapons should escape the same scrutiny any other product cant.

And again, you talk of 9mm being used by police and military. YEP, and they also do hundreds of hours per month training for stress shooting situations, something a layperson does not do or have the private money to do at that same level. Target shooting is not the same training as shooting under stress.

Yes a 22 can be deadly, but it isn't designed to spew bullets at a high rate either. Limiting clip size may not stop a shooter, but when that limited clip runs out, it can provide time for people to confront, or flee.

And again, regardless of model, the cheapest way to reduce firearm violence is for the companies to care where their products end up.

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I am against murder.  I am a Christian.  I do not dream up ways of murdering people.  Just because I said a bullet is lethal does not mean I dream up ways of murdering someone.

Holy crap, you think you are special? You think you are the only religion whom think they magically got it right.

I am NOT talking about your intent. I am addressing your bad logic.

I didn't say you dreamed up ways to kill your fellow human beings. I said HUMANS dream up ways to kill their fellow human beings. But you do talk in this thread about firearms as if they should be blindly defended like a god or a Playboy centerfold. Don't take it personally, I see the same bullshit tribalism in every religion worldwide.

YOU DO  worship firearms otherwise you wouldn't be fighting me, you'd be working with me.

(May 16, 2019 at 9:49 am)onlinebiker Wrote: A 22 long rifle is a lethal weapon. I've seen many 1000 lbs steer dropped with a single headshot.


I don' t give a shit WHAT ammo you stick in a 9mm. Unless you use poison on the bullet - It's still going to be outclassed by anything with a larger case capacity.
It's always going to be a little bullet.

If you believe otherwise- you don't understand physics and you believe advertising hype.

I'm calling shenanigans on the bulless ball story. I saw one shot point blank square between the eyes and it just blinked and jerked his head back, and went nuts.. later it fell over and started crazy seizure convulsions.

then if a 9mm is always out classed, then how can a smaller than a pea .22 or 2.24mm kill a full sized bull instantly?

9mm has penatrating power a slower moving .45 doesn't. I had this old car we use to shoot the 9mm went all the way through while the 45 usally made pimples on the way out

(May 16, 2019 at 3:08 pm)Drich Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 9:49 am)onlinebiker Wrote: A 22 long rifle is a lethal weapon. I've seen many 1000 lbs steer dropped with a single headshot.


I don' t give a shit WHAT ammo you stick in a 9mm. Unless you use poison on the bullet - It's still going to be outclassed by anything with a larger case capacity.
It's always going to be a little bullet.

If you believe otherwise- you don't understand physics and you believe advertising hype.

I'm calling shenanigans on the bulless ball story. I saw one shot point blank square between the eyes and it just blinked and jerked his head back, and went nuts.. later it fell over and started crazy seizure convulsions.

then if a 9mm is always out classed, then how can a smaller than a pea .22 or 2.24mm kill a full sized bull instantly?

9mm has penatrating power a slower moving .45 doesn't. I had this old car we use to shoot the 9mm went all the way through while the 45 usally made pimples on the way out

There is also a difference between billiards and bumper pool. But neither game, as related as they are, cause 36,000 firearm deaths per year.

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I promise you CD, if it came to a civil war, I personally will NOT raise a firearm to you. If your bullshit worship of an object leads you to shoot and kill me, the universe would still continue, as it has for 13.8  billion years. And the earth for 4 billion years and 5 mass extinctions.

But make no mistake about it, do not confuse my non violence for silence. "Out of my cold dead hands" is bullshit lack of pragmatism, and purely tribal emotionalism. I cannot speak for other atheists here. But I do speak for myself.

Weapons do not solve problems long term, but only short term. Humanity in the scope of centuries have to grapple with the fact we only have one planet to live on and conquest is only temporary.

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(May 16, 2019 at 12:52 pm)CDF47 Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 12:50 pm)Brian37 Wrote: YES IT DOES MATTER MORON!

Nadar didn't tell car companies their products sucked because he wanted to hurt business owners. He told them their products sucked because they did. And funny that, despite all that kicking and screaming the auto industry managed to learn to improve their products and still make money.

And quoting an firearm apology website to me is no fucking different than a Muslim apology website.

The founders also had no way of knowing how technology would change. Your bullshit logic would be insisting on running cell phone technology off of rotary phone technology.

If laws were never intended to be updated, we'd also still own slaves, and women would still not be able to vote.

The 2nd amendment should never change.  It was not intended to.  It is prevent tyranny primarily.

STOP BEING HALF ASS'D JACKASS! 

If our laws were never subject to review or change, then how is it women can vote and segregation ended?

THE FOUNDERS had no way of knowing we'd go from muskets to Ar-15s. If you are so fucking stupid to blindly support that logic, what if my liberal side had a majority control of all military and civilian weapons?

If you love Ar-15s so much DUMBASS, knowing I don't agree with you, what if I built a group of "leftists" who used Ar-15s to threaten you?

Bullets that explode have explosives in them.

Bullets that fragment on impact are frangible rounds.


They are NOT more deadly in a low power round like 9mm - which are generally subsonic. ( under the right conditions you can actually see as 9mm bullet in flight.)

Frangibles are to prevent over- penetration - to help eliminate collateral damage in a shooting. It' s why air marshals use almost exclusively 9mm frangible.


Frabgibles are only more deadly in transonic bullets - those travelling at speeds well in excess of 2000 fps.

(May 16, 2019 at 1:44 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 1:33 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: Nah, it wouldn't fit.

Then you wouldn't have put it in the gun.  But - through sheer, dogged persistence - if you DID manage to jam it in, it would probably wreck the pistol.

Boru

Shocked!

NO sexy talk in a gun thread!

(May 16, 2019 at 2:36 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 2:30 pm)CDF47 Wrote: I am talking about myself personally.  Not talking about history.

You implied that you were against murder and didn't dream up ways of killing people because you are a christian. LOL

Yes, thou shall not murder is one of the Ten Commandments.

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(May 16, 2019 at 2:47 pm)Brian37 Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 12:53 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: That makes you an anti-constitutionalist.

No shit, if the founders set it in stone, then they wouldn't have written into it a way to add or remove amendments.

All this proves to me, is that CD is not interested in problem solving, but protecting his own ego.

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(May 16, 2019 at 2:36 pm)Gawdzilla Sama Wrote: You implied that you were against murder and didn't dream up ways of killing people because you are a christian. LOL

Invent a hero motif, regardless of logical fallacies, and you can get desperate humans to follow you off of a cliff.

I will only say that there is not one religion who owns the sole patent on gullibility.

---

(May 16, 2019 at 2:36 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:

Boru

And funny that, the God character had no problem killing the Egyptian firstborn, or drowning toddlers and pregnant women in a flood.

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(May 16, 2019 at 2:14 pm)CDF47 Wrote: That is why gun safety is so critical as well as knowing the four gun safety rules.

https://www.hunter-ed.com/blog/4-essenti...rm-safety/

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I have anxiety problems but blood pressure is normal actually.

---

I am against murder.  I am a Christian.  I do not dream up ways of murdering people.  Just because I said a bullet is lethal does not mean I dream up ways of murdering someone.

Holy crap, you think you are special? You think you are the only religion whom think they magically got it right.

I am NOT talking about your intent. I am addressing your bad logic.

I didn't say you dreamed up ways to kill your fellow human beings. I said HUMANS dream up ways to kill their fellow human beings. But you do talk in this thread about firearms as if they should be blindly defended like a god or a Playboy centerfold. Don't take it personally, I see the same bullshit tribalism in every religion worldwide.

YOU DO  worship firearms otherwise you wouldn't be fighting me, you'd be working with me.

I don't think I am special.  It is not bad logic and I don't worship firearms.  They are a hobby of mine.  I only worship God.

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(May 16, 2019 at 3:11 pm)Brian37 Wrote:

(May 16, 2019 at 3:08 pm)Drich Wrote: I'm calling shenanigans on the bulless ball story. I saw one shot point blank square between the eyes and it just blinked and jerked his head back, and went nuts.. later it fell over and started crazy seizure convulsions.

then if a 9mm is always out classed, then how can a smaller than a pea .22 or 2.24mm kill a full sized bull instantly?

9mm has penatrating power a slower moving .45 doesn't. I had this old car we use to shoot the 9mm went all the way through while the 45 usally made pimples on the way out

There is also a difference between billiards and bumper pool. But neither game, as related as they are, cause 36,000 firearm deaths per year.

---

I promise you CD, if it came to a civil war, I personally will NOT raise a firearm to you. If your bullshit worship of an object leads you to shoot and kill me, the universe would still continue, as it has for 13.8  billion years. And the earth for 4 billion years and 5 mass extinctions.

But make no mistake about it, do not confuse my non violence for silence. "Out of my cold dead hands" is bullshit lack of pragmatism, and purely tribal emotionalism. I cannot speak for other atheists here. But I do speak for myself.

Weapons do not solve problems long term, but only short term. Humanity in the scope of centuries have to grapple with the fact we only have one planet to live on and conquest is only temporary.

---

(May 16, 2019 at 12:52 pm)CDF47 Wrote: The 2nd amendment should never change.  It was not intended to.  It is prevent tyranny primarily.

STOP BEING HALF ASS'D JACKASS! 

If our laws were never subject to review or change, then how is it women can vote and segregation ended?

THE FOUNDERS had no way of knowing we'd go from muskets to Ar-15s. If you are so fucking stupid to blindly support that logic, what if my liberal side had a majority control of all military and civilian weapons?

If you love Ar-15s so much DUMBASS, knowing I don't agree with you, what if I built a group of "leftists" who used Ar-15s to threaten you?

For one I am not a dumb ass.  It is two words by the way smart guy.  Why would you and a group of leftists threaten me with ARs?  

I know laws are subject to change.  However, again, the intent of this law is primarily intended to prevent tyranny.  We need something at least close to what the military and law enforcement carry to defend ourselves with.

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(May 16, 2019 at 4:19 pm)onlinebiker Wrote: Bullets that explode have explosives in them.

Bullets that fragment on impact are frangible rounds.


They are NOT more deadly in a low power round like 9mm - which are generally subsonic. ( under the right conditions you can actually see as 9mm bullet in flight.)

Frangibles are to prevent over- penetration - to help eliminate collateral damage in a shooting. It' s why air marshals use almost exclusively 9mm frangible.


Frabgibles are only more deadly in transonic bullets - those travelling at speeds well in excess of 2000 fps.

Some interesting information.  I knew some of that but learned some things.