What is the point of having the cake if it is not meant to be eaten?

(December 11, 2014 at 8:32 pm)IATIA Wrote:

(December 11, 2014 at 12:30 pm)Godschild Wrote: All religions that are taxed would be able to display there religious symbols and creeds on public property ...

There is not enough room at city hall for every religious symbol and creed, so which ones should we ignore and which ones should we favor?

Quote:... they would be able to carry out prayer in local government as part of their proceedings. School lead prayer at ball games, prayers to start the day of school and ect.

Which prayers of which denominations? To favor every religion, there would no time for the football game, school etc.. So again, who do we favor and who do we ignore?

I would bet that in most city halls....there is enough room to display all the religious symbols of the faiths practiced in that city. Maybe not in New York City....but certainly in Mayberry USA.

(December 11, 2014 at 12:57 pm)Nope Wrote:

(December 10, 2014 at 6:55 pm)Godschild Wrote: even businesses have begun to forbid there employees to tell people marry Christmas. That is violating there right to free speech, they have been pushed by the ACLU and it's policies people are now restricted to express there speech and belief. The ACLU's agenda is to silence all eventually, wait and see.
So, you would be fine with prayer in school and all government meetings, I can just hear the screaming from the ACLU and their supporters.
GC

Business are not the government. A business can create rules for its employees that will help the business

For example, it isn't a violation of free speech for a business to create a rule that no one can curse or that their employees must greet customers as they walk in the door. Whether or not a business uses certain phrases, like Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays, will depend on what they believe that their customers prefer. Blame capitalism when businesses want their employees to say Happy Holidays instead of Merry Christmas not taxes or the government.

I never said the government nor taxes was the reason a business suppresses the use of Christian language, you are grabbing at straws, desperate to get out of an argument you want win. Once the Christian community started going shopping else where they decided their employees could say Merry Christmas. It had nothing to do with what their customers preferred, it came down to money and the fact that management doesn't like the word Christmas, they do like our money though.

GC

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(December 11, 2014 at 1:00 pm)Tonus Wrote:

(December 11, 2014 at 12:30 pm)Godschild Wrote: All religions that are taxed would be able to display there religious symbols and creeds on public property, they would be able to carry out prayer in local government as part of their proceedings.

If they paid for it, sure. It would be like any other sponsorship, and various denominations could compete for the best spots to display their icons and sacred texts. I mean, the local City Hall doesn't put up posters of the latest Mazda sedan just because the dealership pays taxes, after all.

Can't advertise in city hall, businesses would over whelm city hall with adds, churches couldn't put up adds either, however the Ten Commandments wouldn't be off limits.

GC

(December 11, 2014 at 9:29 pm)Godschild Wrote:

(December 11, 2014 at 12:57 pm)Nope Wrote: Business are not the government. A business can create rules for its employees that will help the business

For example, it isn't a violation of free speech for a business to create a rule that no one can curse or that their employees must greet customers as they walk in the door. Whether or not a business uses certain phrases, like Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays, will depend on what they believe that their customers prefer. Blame capitalism when businesses want their employees to say Happy Holidays instead of Merry Christmas not taxes or the government.

I never said the government nor taxes was the reason a business suppresses the use of Christian language, you are grabbing at straws, desperate to get out of an argument you want win. Once the Christian community started going shopping else where they decided their employees could say Merry Christmas. It had nothing to do with what their customers preferred, it came down to money and the fact that management doesn't like the word Christmas, they do like our money though.

GC

Your statement makes no sense in the context of our discussion. You were the one who brought up Merry Christmas and taxes.

As far as grabbing at straws, I suspect that you don't actually believe anything that you write on this board or you are just extremely dishonest.

(December 11, 2014 at 1:36 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote: If they incorporate as a 501©3 and follow the rules for that tax status, they should get the tax breaks that come with it.

Don't need it we are not obligated to pay taxes, you all want separation and I'm just agreeing, separation has to be in taxes as well. it is a government apparatus.

GC

(December 11, 2014 at 9:29 pm)Godschild Wrote: Can't advertise in city hall, businesses would over whelm city hall with adds, churches couldn't put up adds either, however the Ten Commandments wouldn't be off limits.

The reason City Hall might forbid advertising is in order to avoid the appearance of undue influence, in which case the Ten Commandments would probably be off-limits as well. But government buildings probably have vending machines, and those may be using exclusive contracts on some level (ie, only Pepsi vending machines). So perhaps there could be religion-specific vending machines, where you could get a Lemon-Lime Holy Water or some Wiccan Mushroom Chews. Hmmm... what if you washed down some mushroom chews with holy water?

The first amendment doesn't say anything about separation of church and state. It merely prohibits Congress from: "impeding the free exercise of religion." I don't see how taxing religious clubs, i.e. churches in the same way other clubs are taxed impedes the free exercise of religion anymore than taxing Christians generally in the same way as other people are taxed impedes the free exercise of religion.

The first amendment also prohibits: "the making of any law respecting an establishment of religion." Spending public money on icons or placing then in publicly owned spaces is the establishment of religion.

(December 11, 2014 at 9:26 pm)Heywood Wrote:

(December 11, 2014 at 8:32 pm)IATIA Wrote: There is not enough room at city hall for every religious symbol and creed, so which ones should we ignore and which ones should we favor?Which prayers of which denominations? To favor every religion, there would no time for the football game, school etc.. So again, who do we favor and who do we ignore?

I would bet that in most city halls....there is enough room to display all the religious symbols of the faiths practiced in that city. Maybe not in New York City....but certainly in Mayberry USA.

Several years ago, I was watching an O'Reilly episode in which he became arranged because some town allowed atheists to put up a display next to a Christian display.

Personally, I wouldn't mind having multiple symbols on public property but it is the right leaning Christians who would go crazy over it. They can't even handle a cashier saying Happy Holidays. How do you think that they would react to the sight of a Satanic statue next to their nativity scene?

(December 11, 2014 at 9:38 pm)Godschild Wrote:

(December 11, 2014 at 1:36 pm)Mister Agenda Wrote: If they incorporate as a 501©3 and follow the rules for that tax status, they should get the tax breaks that come with it.

Don't need it we are not obligated to pay taxes, you all want separation and I'm just agreeing, separation has to be in taxes as well. it is a government apparatus.

GC

Churches are not obligated to pay taxes because they have been exempted. The Income Tax was enacted well over a century after the Bill of Rights was written.

The question now is, has that exemption outlived its usefulness...if indeed it ever had any usefulness.

(December 11, 2014 at 9:26 pm)Heywood Wrote:

(December 11, 2014 at 8:32 pm)IATIA Wrote: There is not enough room at city hall for every religious symbol and creed, so which ones should we ignore and which ones should we favor?Which prayers of which denominations? To favor every religion, there would no time for the football game, school etc.. So again, who do we favor and who do we ignore?

I would bet that in most city halls....there is enough room to display all the religious symbols of the faiths practiced in that city. Maybe not in New York City....but certainly in Mayberry USA.

Several years ago, I was watching an O'Reilly episode in which he became arranged because some town allowed atheists to put up a display next to a Christian display.

Personally, I wouldn't mind having multiple symbols on public property but it is the right leaning Christians who would go crazy over it. They can't even handle a cashier saying Happy Holidays. How do you think that they would react to the sight of a Satanic statue next to their nativity scene?