Who's winning?

Quote:Satan is the father of lies.

That guy who was created by God according to the Bible. Too improvident for someone who is all-knowing.

I don't know how anyone can claim absolute certainty of anything while talking about a magical being that is a professional liar and deceiver.

I imagine he's good enough at his job that you'd still think you are correct, even when you've been duped. Otherwise, he's not very scary. He'd be the father of niggling doubts.

(March 24, 2015 at 8:05 am)professor Wrote: How interesting Atlas, that you quoted a bunch of your verses focused only on someone ELSE's evil.
While neglecting your own.
This is called "Self righteousness" and is a delusion. A lie.
A lie upon which ALL the religions of the world System (created by the devil) have as their foundation.
Satan is the father of lies.
It is high time to wake up from the stupor of drinking his lies.
A good prayer is:
God in Heaven- SHOW ME Your Truth......

Don't even think for a second that your own religion doesn't do the same thing. Right in this good christian country of USA, christian republicans fear monger about islamic terrorism while ignoring the fact that the biggest terrorist threat to america comes from local right wing religious extremist groups.

Chad, I sure agree with you to an extent.
There are many churches entrained in self righteousness.
It is amazing how closely your view on the threats to America parallel that of the antichrist.
Who IS the greatest threat to this country and like Hitler before him, will wreak havoc upon the country he leads.

Hitler was a good christian boy who took the old testament commandments that talked about killing non christians too seriously. I'm not sure why people would think he's the antichrist. He sounds more like the logical extreme of taking the bible too seriously.

(March 23, 2015 at 12:53 pm)AtlasS2 Wrote: If it is God, then whatever God decides to do is pure is it not? For Christians God is the standard. This means He gets to do whatever He wants. He does not live by standards Eg: There is a universal standard of 'pureity or goodness' that God must meet, to be judge pure by man.

Quote:Such a god, that has no code of ethics like the heathen gods, is indeed not worthy of respect or warship.

Clearly God does have 'ethics' as the are written in both the Old and New Testaments.

But, again just because those 'ethics' do not align themselves to what you or your belief system think ethics should look like does not mean He is without them.

Determining 'ethics' is not the role for man. This is however is the role Atheists and the creators of false gods do. The worshiper of God's role is to follow the ethics set by Him, not to judge them.

Quote:Indeed god does what he wants. But the respect wasn't injected from the fact of him having super abilities, the respect is forced & injected, from the law of ethics he wrote upon himself before writing it on humans.

Just so we are clear.. Are you saying that we should not respect God because He has ablities we do not. That we should respect God because of the ethics and law he wrote?

If this is the case i disagree. This is no different than what the atheist do now. They do not respect the authority of God, because He is the creator. They respect their version of 'morality' first then theyhonor themselves for creating such high and holier then God rules.

This is basically what you are saying we should do with a slight difference. respect the principle or rule of law first, and God for writting it.

That gives complete power to the ones who tend and teach the law. This did not work with the Jews, it does not work for radical Islam, The Dark age Christian Church, nor does it work for Atheist. why would it work anywhere? The problem with that is it gives the power and authority of God to people, Priests. Imams, or law makers. That kind of power corrupts absolutly, and always ends with Man using religion to manipulate his brothers into doing his will rather than God's.

We should respect God First because He has created EVERYTHING, and all of Creation is under Him. This means He is the beginning and End of all things which literally means whatever He says is Good, is Good, and whatever He says is bad is bad. No matter what we think should be good or bad.

If God wants to have sex then it is right for Him to do so (Understand I am not saying He has or will) I am just not one to tell God what He can and can not do. Again to judge God as you have puts you (the judge) in a position of Power over God. Otherwise you could not say God can or can not do this 'thing.'

Quote:Yes, nobody questions his ability in doing what he wants. The Quran asserted it millions of times. Yet what he wanted, and what he chose, is that law of ethics, that universal standard, that he deemed anybody who denies it with hell.

This contradicts what you just said.

You said God could not have a sexual relationship. That He would be no different than a greek god.. Now you say God can do whatever He wants... Which is it? If God wanted to have sex could he or are these 'ethics' you speak of greater than your understanding of God?

If your system of belief what has greater power your understanding of the law or your understanding of God?

If your law is greater than God can not have sex.

If your God is Greater your God can do anything he wants including having Sex. (which BTW is the case of the God of Christianity as it is pointed out over and over and over again on this website.)

Quote:The same standard, that when humans broke, they turned into countries & armies armed to the teeth to corrupt earth & burn with atomic weapons.

No idea what you mean here

Quote:Not if god himself created it. God is then greater than that standard, since he is the one who wrote it & created it out of nothing.

If then God is greater than a given standard can He do something outside that standard, or rather your understanding of it?

Example We claim to both worship the God of abraham. That God told Moses and the Jews You shall not Murder, yet God orders the complete geneocide of complete nations.. This is what I mean by God being greater than the standard of 'ethics.'

Is your idea of God greater than the 'ethic' you pointed out that says He can not have sex?

will finish later...

(March 24, 2015 at 10:00 am)Drich Wrote: But, again just because those 'ethics' do not align themselves to what you or your belief system think ethics should look like does not mean He is without them.

Determining 'ethics' is not the role for man. This is however is the role Atheists and the creators of false gods do.

The worshiper of God's role is to follow the ethics set by Him, not to judge them.

In other words, you do not know whether you are right or wrong to follow "God's ethics," since you lack any skill in judging the matter. So when someone says, "Drich, what makes you judge it wrong to murder?" your answer must be: "I don't know. I am not able to judge," which is the same as saying, "Because I follow God's ethics. How do I know those are morally just? I don't."

(March 24, 2015 at 10:00 am)Drich Wrote: We should respect God First because He has created EVERYTHING, and all of Creation is under Him.

Is a child obligated to respect his or her parent after the parent neglects the child, watches it starve, get beaten, sexually assaulted, etc., all under orders that the parent set in motion? Remember, you have no ability to judge whether or not it is morally just or good to respect a creator on account of his words and actions because

(March 24, 2015 at 10:00 am)Drich Wrote: He is the beginning and End of all things which literally means whatever He says is Good, is Good, and whatever He says is bad is bad. No matter what we think should be good or bad.

Here is another moral judgment you make, in contradiction to your claim of not being able to judge:

(March 24, 2015 at 10:00 am)Drich Wrote: If God wants to have sex then it is right for Him to do so.

Again, you can't say that because

(March 24, 2015 at 10:00 am)Drich Wrote: to judge God as you have puts you (the judge) in a position of Power over God. Otherwise you could not say God can or can not do this 'thing.'

So stop judging God and saying what he does is right or wrong, good or bad.

Drich Wrote:Meaning these are the roles these three deities of God suport. God the Father enacts the traditional role of a father in a traditional Jewish house hold. Then God the Son enacts the role of a first born Son is said house, a the Holy Spirit is a Unseen intermetary between the Father and us.

(March 23, 2015 at 12:53 pm)AtlasS2 Wrote: Exactly, descriptions, or adjectives. Which were negated, by the fact of the body gets separated & reborn under the name Jesus, as a human.

Uh, no.
Nothing is negated.

God the Father is still 'God.'
God the Son is still 'God'
God the Holy Spirit is still 'God.'

Remember the word God is a title it describes a Job or position. All three members have and hold their positions before durning and after Jesus' time on Earth.

Quote:There is nothing concerning reproduction in the God head.

Quote:Exactly. Though, it was again enforced on Christianity, by stating that he did reproduce via Marry peace be upon her.

The phrase "there is nothing concerning reproduction in the God head, means The Holy Spirit nor the Son were 'born' somewhere in Heaven.

Whatever it means to have the "Holy Spirit come on you" does not matter when One's God is greater than any standard or Law. It is only problematic if one worship law or ethics above God.

Quote:.

Exactly. I actually agree.

Good.

---

(March 24, 2015 at 10:17 am)Nestor Wrote: In other words, you do not know whether you are right or wrong to follow "God's ethics," since you lack any skill in judging the matter. So when someone says, "Drich, what makes you judge it wrong to murder?" your answer must be: "I don't know. I am not able to judge," which is the same as saying, "Because I follow God's ethics. How do I know those are morally just? I don't.".

It's not a matter of skill, but one of authority.. So what if you and those like you find God in violation of your morality.. What are you and the rest of your kangaroo court going to do about it? Call him names on your way out of His presents forever? Worship yourself and Your fellow man?

Again, your authority and everyone else's means nothing to God, so how then do you suppose you can judge God if nothing you think matters?

Quote:Is a child obligated to respect his or her parent after the parent neglects the child, watches it starve, get beaten, sexually assaulted, etc., all under orders that the parent set in motion?

what makes you think all who endure such things are Children of God to begin with?

Remember, you have no ability to judge whether or not it is morally just or good to respect a creator on account of his words and actions because

(March 24, 2015 at 10:00 am)Drich Wrote: He is the beginning and End of all things which literally means whatever He says is Good, is Good, and whatever He says is bad is bad. No matter what we think should be good or bad.

:thumbsup:

Quote:Here is another moral judgment you make, in contradiction to your claim of not being able to judge:

(March 24, 2015 at 10:00 am)Drich Wrote: If God wants to have sex then it is right for Him to do so.

Again, you can't say that because

(March 24, 2015 at 10:00 am)Drich Wrote: to judge God as you have puts you (the judge) in a position of Power over God. Otherwise you could not say God can or can not do this 'thing.'

So stop judging God and saying what he does is right or wrong, good or bad.

Ah, you don't understand the primary defination of the word judgement..
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/judgment

Look at defination 1a.[/quote]

Best thread ever!
1 muslim, 2 christians "fighting" their differences out.
Atlas is getting my vote for best theist next January.