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RE: What beliefs would we consider reasonable for a self proclaimed Christian to hold?
February 1, 2018 at 11:24 pm
(This post was last modified: February 1, 2018 at 11:28 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Seeing as how most christians don't believe what they're supposed to..or even know what they're supposed to believe..I doubt it would have ended up much differently than it has. Despite the declaration that arianism is heretical, christian faiths still talk about gods begotten son, and more than a few christians would tell you he was born on 0 ad..not at the beginning of time, and that he spends his days interceding on your behalf with the big man, his boss..god almighty.
The "arian heresy" is a boringly common interpretation of christology, I;d wager that more people believe that than the the musty old bullshit that professional theologians or the more committed but relatively rare nutters would expound..and that's pretty much how Constantine saw it as well. He threw his weight behind the creed and against arius for cynical reasons related to empire..not god.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: What beliefs would we consider reasonable for a self proclaimed Christian to hold?
February 2, 2018 at 8:43 am
You may well be right. I don't know. But think of the effects of it being official doctrine.
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RE: What beliefs would we consider reasonable for a self proclaimed Christian to hold?
February 2, 2018 at 9:40 am
(February 1, 2018 at 11:24 pm)Khemikal Wrote: Seeing as how most christians don't believe what they're supposed to..or even know what they're supposed to believe..I doubt it would have ended up much differently than it has. Despite the declaration that arianism is heretical, christian faiths still talk about gods begotten son, and more than a few christians would tell you he was born on 0 ad..not at the beginning of time, and that he spends his days interceding on your behalf with the big man, his boss..god almighty.
The "arian heresy" is a boringly common interpretation of christology, I;d wager that more people believe that than the the musty old bullshit that professional theologians or the more committed but relatively rare nutters would expound..and that's pretty much how Constantine saw it as well. He threw his weight behind the creed and against arius for cynical reasons related to empire..not god.
A lot of people say the sun rises in the East but that doesn't mean they dont know the Earth turns.
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RE: What beliefs would we consider reasonable for a self proclaimed Christian to hold?
February 2, 2018 at 1:40 pm
(February 2, 2018 at 8:43 am)polymath257 Wrote: You may well be right. I don't know. But think of the effects of it being official doctrine. Such as?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: What beliefs would we consider reasonable for a self proclaimed Christian to hold?
February 2, 2018 at 1:59 pm
Well, it would have affected the books adopted for the Bible. I doubt Revelation would be in there. nor would some of the Pauline letters. That would make a big difference, I think.
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RE: What beliefs would we consider reasonable for a self proclaimed Christian to hold?
February 2, 2018 at 2:01 pm
(This post was last modified: February 2, 2018 at 2:04 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Doubtful, the dispute between the proto-orthodox and the arians was a dispute over how the same books should be interpreted. Two sets of fanatics with compelling financial interests in their own dogma went at it....and the weight of empire came crashing down on one of them. That would have played out the same, in reverse. Constantine didn't give a fuck about either of their interpretations. He just wanted to consolidate his authority. Had the arian faction been able to offer that then he would have went with them and the rest isn't likely to have changed much. Remember, at his point, it doesn't seem to have mattered which books were included or who was declared to be a heretic in thi context..as a large number of christians ended up believing in the heresy anyway, people weren;t reading magic book back in the day any more than they do today.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: What beliefs would we consider reasonable for a self proclaimed Christian to hold?
March 1, 2018 at 2:03 am
After reading this thread it is most obvious that the atheist here have no idea what Christianity means. It's surprising how little the ones who claim they were Christians and then left the faith actually know or remember. This is why I've always challenged them to prove their claim and I will always maintain that challenge. You all do not have nor get the right to rewrite the Christian faith and whether you want to believe it or not God will never allow such a rewriting of His loving plan for mankind. It really is to bad you have glued those blinders over your eyes, it will be truly sad if you miss out on Paradise.
GC
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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RE: What beliefs would we consider reasonable for a self proclaimed Christian to hold?
March 1, 2018 at 3:02 am
(This post was last modified: March 1, 2018 at 3:03 am by robvalue.)
Someone saying they are Christian doesn't tell me anything. I just allow them to tell me what they believe.
I could make educated guesses, but I don't see the point.
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RE: What beliefs would we consider reasonable for a self proclaimed Christian to hold?
March 1, 2018 at 9:50 am
(March 1, 2018 at 3:02 am)robvalue Wrote: Someone saying they are Christian doesn't tell me anything. I just allow them to tell me what they believe.
I could make educated guesses, but I don't see the point.
It usually involves something along the lines of "There was this guy called Jesus and he was magic and I like him an awful lot" but other than that yeah.... the idea of a human-like God that is invisible and intangible doesn't really say anything.
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RE: What beliefs would we consider reasonable for a self proclaimed Christian to hold?
March 1, 2018 at 10:14 am
(This post was last modified: March 1, 2018 at 10:16 am by The Grand Nudger.)
It would hardly be paradise if it were full of assholes, GC. The only thing I;d be "missing out" on was being forced into your company for eternity. You can see how that makes heaven a hard sell..right? If you're gonna dangle it out there, carrot and stick style..it's supposed to be enticing.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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