Quote:This took place in the spiritual world.

(March 28, 2018 at 9:07 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: There is another viewpoint. It's one where neither Abraham sought to kill his son literally neither did God order him to. 

What I wanted to show in all this, is don't get tunneled vision when approaching a verse.

UGGGGGGG!

No MK, I get the same argument from Christians on this same story. 

No sorry, but the further back in time you go the more literally humans took the words. BACK THEN, most people literally believed in that mythology as if it were not mythology, but a factual historical event.

Again, the reason the story exists at all isn't because a God exists, or that Abraham or Issac did for that matter.

The reason any "sacrifice" motif existed back then, IN ALL OF ANTIQUITY, WORLD WIDE, was because humans lived under local tribal royalty and BACK THEN your duty was to that local ruling family. If your king demanded you did something, YOU DID IT or risk being cast out, or death.

Even with the South American ancient Mayans, there was this religious belief of the "magic of blood" and even they would sacrifice their own to their gods.

BACK THEN most Christians and Muslims and even Jews, saw "sacrifice" as a good thing, even if it meant a a member of the tribe died for the "greater good".

But I am impressed, you are doing the very back pedaling from literal word to metaphorical, which is a far better position to be than literal. 

If you literally believed that Abraham literally would have killed his own kid, I'd worry about you doing that to a real human. It is fiction, and I hope you come to see that. But, at least you are to the point of not taking that story literally.

(March 28, 2018 at 9:09 pm)Khemikal Wrote:

(March 28, 2018 at 8:43 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote: He doesn't "want to know", he already knows.
But this is how life is: what God "knows" is what happens. Fate is already written; but for it to happen, it must take place in real time.

Only a dick would ask what he already knows..about killing a persons kid.

(March 28, 2018 at 8:47 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote: You see; troll ?

He is cursing God :

Really..am I cursing god..or are you?  You;re the one who says he told abraham to kill his kid for the lulz, even though he already knew what abraham would do.

He is not asking. God is unlike anything we ever know; he doesn't "ask" like a human would ask. When a verse says "God spoke to...", it's not "normal talk" like the one we're having now.

In other words; it's called a "revelation" for a reason.
I think you're making a big mistake by using "Anthropomorphism" in here.

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It's the same with the whale the swallowed Jonus. It represented his grief form in the spiritual world, it overcame him. 

And the animals on the navigating ships that are by the name of God in their sial, it refers to aspects of humans. We unite all aspects of the animal and plant world, and every aspect has two versions, two pairs. 

And the one to carry and drive is the Leader and Guide, the Captain, who all things are embraced and encompassed in.

(March 28, 2018 at 8:57 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote:

(March 28, 2018 at 8:49 pm)chimp3 Wrote: Fuck that shit! Abraham was a psychopath! If loyalty is an option for you, then you are a psychopath too! If you hear voices telling you to kill anybody, please save others needless trauma and check yourself into a psych hospital. Voices telling you to kill will get you admitted these days! Why? Because, as a society, we have morally and rationally progressed since the bronze age.

His faith was so strong that he was ready to kill his own. 

That's not a strong faith.  That's a weak constitution.  I suffer no such malady.  God tells me to kill my kid..I tell god to do it his goddamned self and I'll be waiting.

Yeah..sure, maybe I couldn't stop him..then again.,...the ummah did crumble and jeff-god is a bit of a fuckup who writes checks his ass can't cash...so.....no sense not trying.

Unless you just don't like your kid, obviously. Like a common bad daddy. Honestly, of all the things to get wrong in service of a "god"...this? Pass.

(March 28, 2018 at 9:30 pm)Khemikal Wrote:

(March 28, 2018 at 8:57 pm)AtlasS33 Wrote: His faith was so strong that he was ready to kill his own. 

That's not a strong faith.  That's a weak constitution.  I suffer no such malady.  God tells me to kill my kid..I tell god to do it his goddamned self and I'll be waiting.

Yeah..sure, maybe I couldn't stop him..then again.,...the ummah did crumble and jeff-god is a bit of a fuckup who writes checks his ass can't cash...so.....no sense not trying.

Unless you just don't like your kid, obviously.  Like a common bad daddy.  Honestly, of all the things to get wrong in service of a "god"...this?  Pass.

That's the hard part in the story: and that's why Abraham is a legend.

Abraham was a loving friend of God who has full of compassion and love for humans, he never stopped praying for people and interceding for them, till he knew they were destined as enemies of God (ie. they died in a state of disbelief), even took it too far once when he couldn't handle Lut's people being destroyed and was begging for the punishment to be averted and began disputing with God.

That is what makes him Legend to me.

He stopped praying for his kid long enough to get a knife and some rope.

It;s a legend to me too....though I don't think that word means what you think it means.........

Hey, look..though, you both agree! Maybe you do follow the same stupid fucking religion after all?

(March 28, 2018 at 9:39 pm)Khemikal Wrote: He stopped praying for his kid long enough to get a knife and some rope.

As I said you should look up the concept of "fana" (annihilation).

You still think that will change my mind?

I hope that neither of you ever has a son..and if you do..I hope that someone like me still exists to stand between you and the kid that you'd each kill in service of allah.  Like I said earlier..mouth of hell, eyes wide open.  Each of you qualifies as the mouth of hell. 

You both shame your god.