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RE: Sam Harris & Maajid Nawaz on reforming Islam
October 29, 2015 at 12:16 pm
(This post was last modified: October 29, 2015 at 12:16 pm by Mystic.)
(October 29, 2015 at 12:12 pm)Rhythm Wrote: So, again, why not just send christian missionaries? If you need a new religion, and that would help.....there are plenty on hand.
Because I am convinced Quran is a guidance, and the Prophet and his successors are Guides. And I believe most Muslims should recognize the Quran as a source of guidance.
But even if I didn't believe in that, I would suggest this path, a path where Muslims seek to follow what is good sincerely, and not simply blindly follow their religious leaders and institutions.
I would also not hope that they would disbelieve in their religion, as that is not going to happen, and is unrealistic expectation.
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RE: Sam Harris & Maajid Nawaz on reforming Islam
October 29, 2015 at 12:16 pm
Can't we reform it into something more useful like a hair dryer?
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RE: Sam Harris & Maajid Nawaz on reforming Islam
October 29, 2015 at 12:18 pm
(This post was last modified: October 29, 2015 at 12:24 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(October 29, 2015 at 12:16 pm)MysticKnight Wrote: (October 29, 2015 at 12:12 pm)Rhythm Wrote: So, again, why not just send christian missionaries? If you need a new religion, and that would help.....there are plenty on hand.
Because I am convinced Quran is a guidance, and the Prophet and his successors are Guides. And I believe most Muslims should recognize the Quran as a source of guidance. They -do- recognize it as a source of guidance..and it's guiding them towards ISIS, or so you've claimed.
Quote:But even if I didn't believe in that, I would suggest this path, a path where Muslims seek to follow what is good sincerely, and not simply blindly follow their religious leaders and institutions.
I would also not hope that they would disbelieve in their religion, as that is not going to happen.
You do hope that they "disbelieve in their religion"....you're hoping to get them to believe in yours........
Those who can sell you absurdity are often capable of compelling you to atrocity. It seems, to me, like you want a "reset", a return to some simpler faith, closer to the original quran as you see it. Well, ISIS is something that flows from that fount. If the solution to the problem is to tell people "return to the well"...they'll come back carrying that same water.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Sam Harris & Maajid Nawaz on reforming Islam
October 29, 2015 at 12:19 pm
(October 29, 2015 at 12:16 pm)robvalue Wrote: Can't we reform it into something more useful like a hair dryer?
I'd settle for a chocolate fucking teapot at this rate. At least it's tasty.
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RE: Sam Harris & Maajid Nawaz on reforming Islam
October 29, 2015 at 12:27 pm
ISIS is not true Islam.
What a surprise. Funnily enough, they'd say exactly the same thing about any Muslim not in ISIS.
Who is right? Neither of them. Religion, and interpretations of religion, are arbitrary.
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RE: Sam Harris & Maajid Nawaz on reforming Islam
October 29, 2015 at 12:30 pm
(This post was last modified: October 29, 2015 at 12:31 pm by Mystic.)
(October 29, 2015 at 12:27 pm)robvalue Wrote: ISIS is not true Islam.
What a surprise. Funnily enough, they'd say exactly the same thing about any Muslim not in ISIS.
Who is right? Neither of them. Religion, and interpretations of religion, are arbitrary.
I've said it before that I can't claim to follow the true Islam or be it's representative. The only one who can say "this is exactly 100% submission to God and his path" authoritatively is a Guide that has clears proofs he is a Guide appointed by God.
And this doesn't mean any scholar but rather the Guide towards God that is chosen by God himself.
I'm not trying to get people to follow perfect Islam anyways. I am trying to get them to follow some essential things that all humans ought to acknowledge.
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RE: Sam Harris & Maajid Nawaz on reforming Islam
October 29, 2015 at 12:32 pm
Oh, OK. What proof do I need to show you?
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RE: Sam Harris & Maajid Nawaz on reforming Islam
October 29, 2015 at 12:38 pm
(This post was last modified: October 29, 2015 at 12:40 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Quote:I am trying to get them to follow some essential things that all humans ought to acknowledge.
Which isn't going to work so long as you appeal to -their- religion...which explicitly commands them not to acknowledge some of those things, or -your- religion...which they don't give two shits about, which does not inform -their- opinions.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Sam Harris & Maajid Nawaz on reforming Islam
October 29, 2015 at 12:39 pm
God has chosen me, I'm just wondering what I need to prove it. He wasn't here long enough for any photos I'm afraid. I did write down some stuff he said, if that helps?
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RE: Sam Harris & Maajid Nawaz on reforming Islam
October 29, 2015 at 12:53 pm
(October 29, 2015 at 12:38 pm)Rhythm Wrote: Quote:I am trying to get them to follow some essential things that all humans ought to acknowledge.
Which isn't going to work so long as you appeal to -their- religion...which explicitly commands them not to acknowledge some of those things, or -your- religion...which they don't give two shits about, which does not inform -their- opinions.
I am appealing to use of reason. We are going in circles.
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