Why did the Jews lie about Jesus?

[Vicki Q]

[The Grand Nudger]

"Pauls" jewish cred appears to have been utter fabrication. For a guy that fashioned himself as some sort of jewish inquisitor, guy didn't seem to know shit about judaism.

[fredd bear]

[Fake Messiah]

Yeah, let's hear what 1 Cor. 15 has to say: "5 and that he appeared to Cephas, and then to the Twelve."

I mean from the start you can see that Paul is lying because there were only eleven, Judas having died.

The Twelve was a technical name, widely used in the Early Church, for the inner circle of Jesus' followers. There is more than a nod to the 12 tribes of Israel. Judas was fairly quickly replaced. 

Hence the capital letter, and the appropriate continued use even when there were temporarily 11 of them.

And yet Matthew 28:16, Mark 16:14, and Luke 24:33 have Jesus appear to the eleven.

I mean, listen, what you just gave was a purely ad-hoc argument and the fact is there is no reason that the Twelve that Paul mentions have anything to do with the Twelve apostles. For starters Paul never uses the word "Apostles" in his writings. Indeed, many scholars that take historical Jesus for granted don't consider that Jesus selected an elite corps of twelve already in his lifetime, rather that the Twelve were so constituted by a shared resurrection vision. One of the many reasons for thinking that is that Jesus himself almost never mentions the Apostles (quoted sayings of Jesus) but "the Twelve" rather occur in narrative sections of the Gospels. And even when in rare occasions when "the Twelve" are on Jesus' lips are doubtful, like Mark 14:20, Jesus says his betrayer is "one of the Twelve," but neither Matthew nor Luke, who follow Mark, have the phrase.

And, also, one other evidence that Jesus never had the Twelve was that the whole story of Jesus choosing the Twelve was clear rewriting of the Moses story when he chose the seventy elders: they both get a visit from their relatives who both have a suggestion that he was overworked and needed to share the burdens of leadership.

And also there is the problem with the names of the Apostles. The canonical lists of the Twelve do not agree in detail, nor do manuscripts of single gospels. If the Twelve were as important as church rhetoric would suggest, how is it possible that such uncertainty should exist even upon the point of who they were? Can we imagine early American histories in which the lists of presidents did not agree? And, of course Cephas of Paul's writings and Simon Peter are not the same character.

[Jehanne]

[Vicki Q]

[The Valkyrie]

What if Jesus lied about the Jews?

[The Grand Nudger]

That certainly seems to be the business that the people who crammed words into the demi-gods mouth were in. Not especially surprising considering the romanization of the authors. They'd had it up to here with a group they saw to be backwards terrorists in need of a little foreign intervention.

[Jehanne]

I would like to question the OP.

It would seem that the "lie" about Jesus allegedly promulgated by the Jews was, in fact, a lie.  The Jews, in the beginning, simply ignored Jesus, at least most of them.

[Fake Messiah]

You're right. It's time for the OPey dokey to finish this topic by giving the answer.

It would seem that the "lie" about Jesus allegedly promulgated by the Jews was, in fact, a lie.  The Jews, in the beginning, simply ignored Jesus, at least most of them.

I think the answer to my question is in fact in "Matthew". "Mathew" is actually a very anti Semitic book that describes how during Jesus' whole life and especially the ministry Jews were plotting to kill him. For instance there is even a line in Matthew 27:25 All the people answered, "His blood is on us and on our children!" Meaning that Jews were accepting Jesus blood as a curse on their future generations.

A line that Mel Gibson didn't fail to put in in his famous movie that is pandering to sadists and masochists who get their jollies drooling over blood.

But the thing is Gibson was forced by political pressure to remove the line from the various-language subtitles. - Imagine that! A line from Bible was forbidden in the movie because it was anti Semitic.

Of course, Gibson did not remove it from the Aramaic dialogue, so anti Semites can still enjoy it.



So according to "Matthew" Jews hated Jesus, they killed Jesus and they knew they would be cursed for that so they wanted to erase his resurrection from existence. Which is another reason to regard Christianity as a conspiracy, because one of the telltale signs something is a conspiracy is when they blame the Jews for everything, as do David Icke with reptilian aliens, Flat Earthers, Moon landings etc.

And that's why Koran is actually more peaceful book that New Testament because it doesn't blame Jews, it even says that Jesus didn't die on a cross but an imposter.