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RE: A really hard question on Satan and deception.
October 20, 2011 at 8:51 am
Gotta give GC credit for really fleshing out his imaginary world.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: A really hard question on Satan and deception.
October 20, 2011 at 9:14 am
Quote:Come to think of it you probably would just as other non believers would, if you have no personal relationship with Christ how could you know.
Give me solid proof that you "relationship with Jesus" isnt actually you being fooled by Satan. Prove to me that Satan hasnt fooled you into thinking you have a relationship with Christ.
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RE: A really hard question on Satan and deception.
October 20, 2011 at 5:14 pm
@GC Point blank!
How do you know that the god you worship is the 'good guy' and has not tricked you into believing that Satan is the 'bad guy'.
You make people miserable and there's nothing they can do about it, just like god.
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RE: A really hard question on Satan and deception.
October 20, 2011 at 5:17 pm
'You all know that I always have answers for everything'
I too love irony.
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RE: A really hard question on Satan and deception.
October 20, 2011 at 8:12 pm
Does anyone find it interesting that the worst periods in history have been controlled by religion? Not only that, does anyone find it odd that god kills thousands of people in the bible, for various twisted reasons which wouldn't in the least merit death today? (Among them being homsexuality, paganism, etc.)
If I had to guess and were not an atheist, I might propose that satan has written or influenced the bible and other holy books, and controls most Christians, Muslims, and other major religions. Thus all the death and suffering, insupportable logic, and biblical contradictions. If a god were to exist, and was just, why would he let Muslims continue to kill Christians and vice versa? It seems like a very satanic move to make both sides large, powerful, and intolerant, and let them fight it out for a few centuries with no idea that they were being fooled the entire time.
Then, of course, god's will is supposedly unknowable. So who is it, exactly, who these Christians claim talks in their heads with such a tempting voice? I personally find it creepy that any form of god would make his holy symbol a torture device.
Of course, I'm an atheist, and I don't believe in any of that. It might get a few theists thinking, though.
What falls away is always, and is near.
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RE: A really hard question on Satan and deception.
October 20, 2011 at 8:36 pm
I doubt it. Thinking has historically proven a struggle for them.
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RE: A really hard question on Satan and deception.
October 24, 2011 at 5:54 pm
(October 20, 2011 at 2:02 am)Godschild Wrote: (October 19, 2011 at 2:07 pm)Greatest I am Wrote: A really hard question on Satan and deception.
GIa Wrote:You all know that I always have answers for everything but these ones have me stumped. That or Satan is deceiving me. How could I know?
If you have never sought out God then Satan doesn't have a need to deceive you. He will let you believe your own ideas, this way he doesn't have to waste time on you.
GIa Wrote:If angels have free will, why has one never shown themselves?
They have read scriptures and you will discover when and where. they appear as men so as to not reveal who they truly are except to those they have been sent to. When they came to people in private they may have appeared as angels. You never know when you might have meet an angel.
GIa Wrote:There are apparently good angels and evil angels that have been renamed as demons.
If either of these showed itself, we could not distinguish it from God himself. No one has ever seen God.
God is Spirit, HE has no physical form,read the scriptures please. The angels have a physical body and you can bet when you come in the presents of God you will surely know.
GIa Wrote:Would we accept it as God and be deceived?
Come to think of it you probably would just as other non believers would, if you have no personal relationship with Christ how could you know.
GIa Wrote:After all, it is said by God that Satan has the power to deceive the whole world.
Knowing this, and knowing that most of the world belongs to one religion or another. It follows that most people in these religions have been deceived.
You are correct about the power of satan, read Mk. 13:22 and you will see that the elect (the followers of Christ) will not be deceived, why, because we have a relationship with the true God and know Him, satan does not have the power to reveal himself as the true God.
GIa Wrote:How then can believers be so sure that they follow the right God?
As scripture indicates that most if not all will be following the wrong God thanks to deception.
The answer is a the same as the above.
GIa Wrote:Are you somehow immune to Satan, who can deceive the whole world?
Yes as I said christians have a relationship with God, we know Him personally and will see through satans attempts to deceive.
GIa Wrote:If atheists are deceived, then there really is a God.
If believers are deceived, then there really is no God.
If a believer, how do you get around this catch 22.
Yes to the first part, no to the second part, why, if a believer was deceived there would have to be a deceiver and since you are making statements about God and satan I assume you are sticking to the story that God created Lucifer who becomes the deceiver by his own choice, thus a deceiver then there must be God.
GIa Wrote:Are morals the only good way around it?
If so, then if you are a believer that believes that Sodom or the genocide of Noah’s day is good justice, does that mean that you have been deceived?
Having good morals will not give you a relationship with Christ, you can do all the good you can stand but you will still belong to satan.
To the second part, those things you mention are just because God who is just determined it was just. The decision He made is just no matter what you or I think. So, no we as christians have not been deceived.
GIa Wrote:Because on the face of it, since non believers are a minority and think it evil, then you, as part of the majority and think it good, must be wrong.
Is genocide then a good thing or an evil thing?
It's neither for you or I to say what is morally right and just only the moral and just God of heaven can determine such, we trust God in His righteousness. For man to commit genocide is wrong, for God to punish the wicked is just and right.
GIa Wrote:Careful, you have definitely been deceived if God was right. Satan has deceived you.
Regards
DL
God is not the deceiver, satan is, and God in His righteousness will keep safe those who accept Him from satans deceptions.
Ah, the blatant stupidity. God is omnipotent, yes? So he could easily appear to have a physical form. Indeed, to be omnipotent, he would be both physical and immaterial at all times, and in ALL other states. Yes?
And as for Satan, as a supposed fallen angel he would carry a portion of God's infinite power, yes? Well, a portion of God's infinite power would also be infinite. Therefore, Satan and all the angels would each be as powerful as God, and all would be material and immaterial, and in all other states and places at the same time.
Therefore, your claims contradict themselves. Even if any of it existed accordingly to the Bible, you would have no way of distinguishing between Satan and God.
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RE: A really hard question on Satan and deception.
October 24, 2011 at 6:02 pm
I have a foolproof method for distinguishing between the two. They're both bullshit.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: A really hard question on Satan and deception.
October 25, 2011 at 1:57 am
(October 20, 2011 at 5:14 pm)IATIA Wrote: @GC Point blank!
How do you know that the god you worship is the 'good guy' and has not tricked you into believing that Satan is the 'bad guy'.
Read MK 13:22. God would not say this if He had already deceived me. God is not the deceiver, if He were the scriptures could not be written as they are. If God were the bad guy He would be the weaker of the two thus not being able to deceive me because satan would not allow it.
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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RE: A really hard question on Satan and deception.
October 25, 2011 at 2:12 am
GIa Wrote:Are you somehow immune to Satan, who can deceive the whole world?
Godschild Wrote:Yes as I said christians have a relationship with God, we know Him personally and will see through satans attempts to deceive.
Wow, that is a bold and huge statement to make Godschild? If this is true, then how do you account for the many "Christian" sects and believers that all read the same old dusty fairytale book and yet come to so many different conclusions and beliefs? In all sincerity it all boils down to interpretation and every Christian church or sect that you can think of say they are led to the proper beliefs by the Holy Spirit and in the end can't even agree on such issues as the trinity, the nature of God, etc.
'but the Paraclete, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you everything and remind you of all I have said to you.' John 14:26 (NJB).
Note: the Paraclete is also called the comforter in the King James translation of the bible it's just another name for the Holy Spirit.
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